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Clunker Math

Discussion in 'Politics, Elections & Legislation' started by grnberetcj, Sep 9, 2009.

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  1. grnberetcj

    grnberetcj Active Member

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    Even if the analysis is off by 2, the numbers are impressive

    · A vehicle at 15 mpg and 12,000 miles per year uses 800 gallons a year of gasoline.

    · A vehicle at 25 mpg and 12,000 miles per year uses 480 gallons a year.

    · So, the average clunker transaction will reduce US gasoline consumption by 320 gallons per year.

    · They claim 700,000 vehicles - so that's 224 million gallons / year.

    · That equates to a bit over 5 million barrels of oil.

    · 5 million barrels of oil is about ¼ of one day's US consumption.

    · And, 5 million barrels of oil costs about $350 million dollars at $75/bbl.

    So, we all contributed to spending $3 billion to save $350 million.

    How good a deal was that???
     
  2. Carol Lister

    Carol Lister TS Member

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    If the savings would last for only 1 year it would be no deal at all. But those clunkers have been on the road for years and considering the owning habits of the people who traded them in, the new ones will be, too. So next year you get the same savings without the outlay and the year after and the year after and so on. Then factor in the inevitable rise in the price of fuel over the lives of those new vehicles and you've saved even more.

    The US auto industry, because of its increasing "closeness" with European car makers, will eventually start to move away from gasoline engines and toward the clean diesel technology that is so widely used where fuel is more expensive. Both BMW and VW offered the $4500 price reduction in their diesel models during the clunker program even though some of BMW's cars were too expensive to qualify for the clunker program. Both manufacturers saw significant increases in the sales of their diesel's as people chose them over American gas-fueled vehicles as they recognized the advantage to the increased fuel mileage and decreased operating expenses that diesels offer.

    Lister
     
  3. stokinpls

    stokinpls Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like my Dad talkin'.

    Me: "I want to trade cars so I can get better mileage."

    Dad: "That $13,000 you're going to need will buy a hell of a lot of gas."
     
  4. Carol Lister

    Carol Lister TS Member

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    That's because your father knows he probably won't be around long enough to have to deal with the eventual consequences of squandering a resource by maintaining a high national dependence on imported oil.

    Lister
     
  5. Bisi

    Bisi TS Member

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    If the idea was to save energy the government should of used that money to build a nuclear power plant.

    What it was really about was to provide work for the "Operation Repo" crew next year and entertainment for us in the future.
     
  6. oldgahchamp

    oldgahchamp Active Member

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    You are also going to be liable for the income tax on that $4500 "gift". Larry Evans
     
  7. Recoil Sissy

    Recoil Sissy Well-Known Member

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    Gentle Readers:

    Cash for Clunkers was a roaring success. I know 'cause Obambi said so.

    It was also great for Chrysler and Gub'ment Motors. So good in fact, taxpayers are likely to lose only "a significant" amount of the $81 billion we dumped down the rat hole instead of the the entire $81 billion.

    Google 'auto bailout news' for more details. Following is the start of just one article...



    Taxpayers will lose on auto bailouts

    Congressional oversight panel says that much of the money lent to GM and Chrysler will never be seen again.

    September 9, 2009: 3:36 AM ET

    NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Much of the money given to General Motors and Chrysler to prevent them from collapsing will never be recovered, according to a report released Wednesday by the Congressional Oversight Panel

    sissy
     
  8. fishguts

    fishguts Member

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    "owning habits"............I didn't realize that it was a "habit" to be unable to afford a $400 car payment, a $100 a month for insurance, $300 a month for gas...alarm not included. I guess that those of us that have are really out of touch with those that have not.

    Maybe we should stop shooting rockets to Neptune and use the billions and billions to buy everyone a new car.

    Wayne
     
  9. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    The dealerships that I visited during the clunker rip off, didn't have but maybe 1% clunkers!

    99% were nice used cars that should have been allowed on the resale market.

    All the program did was hurt the POOR!

    Way to go liberals, I though you claim to be all about helping the poor and down troden!
     
  10. cementman

    cementman Member

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    Federal Income Tax
    If you’re talking about federal income taxes, then the answer is no. As a consumer, you won’t owe taxes to the Federal government for the credit you received as a result of the Cash for Clunkers trade-in. The official program website, Cars.gov is very specific about this. See this excerpt from their FAQs:

    “Is the credit subject to being taxed as income to the consumers that participate in the program? NO. The CARS Act expressly provides that the credit is not income for the consumer.”

    There are some complex rules on how a business must treat the sale of the clunker. For more on those rules, visit Cash for Clunkers Business Tax Rules.
     
  11. markdenis

    markdenis TS Member

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    If I trade/bought a new vehicle, will my taxes go up? I guarantee 100% it will!
     
  12. bigdogtx

    bigdogtx Well-Known Member

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    Carol,,,,if we would drill HERE then we wouldn't have to worry about dependence on FOREIGN oil,,,,ever think of that one????
     
  13. Carol Lister

    Carol Lister TS Member

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    <blockquote>",,,,if we would drill HERE then we wouldn't have to worry about dependence on FOREIGN oil,,,,ever think of that one????"</blockquote>

    Sure I've thought of it, but so what? Where is "here"? All the easy oil in the existing oil fields has been tapped (Note: "existing oil fields"... the places Americans want to restrict all future oil exploration to).

    As soon as an administration suggests exploring or drilling in some nature preserve, national park or other sacred bit of land or water, all hell breaks loose. Americans would rather buy their oil from some other country than dirty a part of their own landscape looking for it on US soil, and the oil companies sure won't spend the money to develop environmentally-friendly technologies to extract tough oil until it's expensive enough that it's worth their economic while to do so. Would you??

    Why hasn't coal been further developed as an energy source? It's not yet economically attractive to spend the money to create clean coal technology as long as coal has to compete with oil and gas.

    Lister
     
  14. grnberetcj

    grnberetcj Active Member

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    Someone definitely failed Econ101 in college (if they even went).

    Unbelieveable!!!!!!! No wonder we're (the USA) in such a mess..

    Curt
     
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