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Club mgt ?

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by 635 G, Jul 27, 2008.

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  1. 635 G

    635 G Well-Known Member

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    If your club is supposed to be run by a group of members ( board), is it really run by the board or by one member (dictator) who seems to have the members of the board under his or her thumb. How many clubs are democracies in name only, but when it comes to reality they are a dictatorship.

    Lou
     
  2. Rem870TB

    Rem870TB Active Member

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    We have another situation; I would like to have more of our members at our small club ACTUALLY care enough to be concerned about this issue.

    Most just want to come out to "play" then disappear like the place is on fire, immediately, when they're done. As long as there are targets thrown, they don't want any input in running the place or to be at all concerned about it's operation and upkeep. I am familiar with saying, 10% of the members do 90% of the work after 40 years of shooting; IMHO, its true.

    A very few of us "run the club" by acclimation; we don't get any tangible compensation for doing this, we pay the same dues and fees as everyone else in this volunteer run operation. However, if someone doesn't do it, this club which has been operational since 1954 will "go away".

    At 56, I do get tired of being "Mr. Mom" to a bunch of guys that are my age or older. (Examples, upcoming meat shoot; "Guys, any suggestions on what you'd like for prizes?", blank stares and silence follows, or, the comment addressed to me from a fellow member; "When are "THEY" going to stain the deck???")

    I would prefer not to be involved on the executive level as well, I don't have the need to run everything I am involved with, I don't know that I am particularily good at it. I prefered the last area I lived in, I belonged to a club w/500 members; I paid my money, shot and helped out on work parties.
     
  3. BDodd

    BDodd TS Member

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    Both of you are voicing the complaint(s) that plague nearly every volunteer run club. Frankly, the very best run clubs I've been around are run by the dictator-type person described above. I've always described this situation as having members, a BOD, a president, and a King! As far as the few being the only ones to volunteer work around the club is so typical that you might as well understand that's the standard for volunteer clubs.

    I was president of a 500+ member club several decades ago having worked up through the chairs on the BOD. At one time, I called for a general membership meeting to discuss the issue of needing more volunteers to assist the elected board members. After giving my speech, I basically was advised, "Well, that's what we elected you to do!"

    That surely put me right in my place and from that moment on the membership got just what it asked for. I presided over meetings, guided the board in making important decisions, and assisted my compatriots as best I could knowing the members didn't consider THE club to be THEIR club or that they, in fact, were THE club. They just wanted us to provide their entertainment. From that time on, I've never exposed myself to the threat of similar abuse.

    Yes, the hired club manager or very strong influence of a dynamic person will often be the answer to a well run club.....breakemall.....Bob Dodd
     
  4. slowdp

    slowdp TS Member

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    Everything expressed above is completely true. The members pay dues for a place to shoot. We have a group who runs silhouette and another group that runs trap. The officers and directors solicit help twice a year for work parties. Maybe 10 to 20 out of 500 members show up to help workdays but that is normally enough.

    The directors try to control dictatorship personalities. We have found the club to run smoother when all officers and directors vote in the decisions. Things get changed slower but the change is usually in the best interest of the club and not just one dictator.

    No one says much in the way of thanks to the officers and directors but they are quick to tell you what you are doing wrong. My response is always the same "Elections are on the way - you can run for office and fix the problem yourself". They usually run for the hills.

    We need to understand that most people are followers. That is ok, we need followers. Most good leaders are too busy with their jobs to do much. This leaves a very few to guide the club. If you have the ability and the time then do it. You don't have to run for office. Don't bitch because you raised your hand. Do what you can to keep shooting alive and enjoy the results. Get out when it is not fun for you.
     
  5. deercreek

    deercreek Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    Indiana
    How true !!!

    I am President of our club, we have really stuck our foot in some asses the last few years. Many just want to pay dues and costs to shoot and leave. It is coming to the point that dues will increase significantly to cover costs of having things done that used to be volunteer efforts, along with the general increases in costs.

    As far as the dictatorship--our decisions are made by the Board of Director's (9) as a whole. It has taken about five or seven years to get most of our policies and procedures in the correct place. The biggest accomplishment is the fact that everything is "done on top of the tables now". What I mean is all decisions, suggestions, and general club busisness is EQUAL and FAIR to all involved.

    Bryan Griffith
     
  6. skeet100

    skeet100 Member

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    Every now and then a bunch of folks show up and then you wish they would leave and let the ones who know what the hell is going on do it all.


    Just a random thought.
     
  7. Rem870TB

    Rem870TB Active Member

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    "It is coming to the point that dues will increase significantly to cover costs of having things done that used to be volunteer efforts, along with the general increases in costs."

    The cost increase will be accompanyed by the usual whining and Ki Yi-ing, no doubt.

    Don't need to tell anyone, times have really changed in my lifetime, crica 1952 to present.

    Volunteer labor has always worked out at about 10% of membership. However, in the 1950's, our original club was built, clubhouse, range etc. by members in their spare time; with present life-style and attitudes, I don't see that happening today. That's just the way it is, for better or worse.

    This is one of several reasons why I keep at it to the best of my abilities and time to help it continue. I remember some of those old guys and it is like we're holding it in trust AND, I fear if it goes, it will be gone for good, no one will step up to the plate and start a new club.

    From the view of many of our membership, many with a 30 year history there, it has always been there for them and always will be; they cannot conceive how it runs on a "shoe string".
     
  8. BIGDON

    BIGDON Well-Known Member

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    Location:
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    Change dues structure. One price to do nothing and another lower price for those that work a set number of hours per year.

    Don
     
  9. Rem870TB

    Rem870TB Active Member

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    "Every now and then a bunch of folks show up and then you wish they would leave and let the ones who know what the hell is going on do it all."

    Been there too, that's not good either, I SLIGHTLY prefer the present situation.

    "Change dues structure. One price to do nothing and another lower price for those that work a set number of hours per year."

    Good idea, seen it tried at some clubs I belonged to in other areas, would LOVE to do it here. In my experience, it is not as cut and dried to adminster and determine what is a sufficient level of work to merrit the lower price and how many hours each person puts in.
     
  10. spitter

    spitter Well-Known Member TS Supporters

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    Location:
    Prairie State
    I'll ditto most, if not all of the above comments as well. I first ran for office, because I didn't like the way things were run and newer members were treated. I retired from the Club's Board in 2001 after 5 year of running things and environmental litigation. Now I run Membership and am a polite PIA to the present Board (lol)!

    But you learn quickly that it can be a thankless job, but when you do get the thanks and respect of your fellow members, it does make the effort put forth worthwhile. One issue I did find, was the problem of replacing yourself... I had to "quit" the Board and gave them 6 months advance notice I would not run again. The Club did not have a President for about 6 months - then someone stepped up... it was a murky strategy, but I had to throw the Club into the deep end of the pool to see who would swim.

    Very few folks want or have the real ability to take the top job, center seat, be the big Kahuna - it takes a type A personality - not a "dictator" perse, but someone with a strong will, who can formulate a vision OR coordinate the strong wills/visions of several people, to attain the overall goals, juggling membership, programming and operational issues. Directors need to find their niche and push or they end up more as lame ducks.

    Regarding "volunteerism", years ago attending NSSF meetings, the American Management Association had seminar in the same resort, with a book table and one of the titles was for non-profits... "Its OK to ask them to Work". Most clubs don't or wont. Demand help from your "shooting" membership.

    I gladly take dues from non-shooting "patron" members, but shoot a few times a year and your tush is mine for a couple of shooting days per year - its only fair and I have no reticence in asking my membership to help running the place. We have also expanded membership requirements and increased oversight.

    If members don't work, that's OK too, there are other clubs. Better to have a core of good members than a legion of mediocre or poor members.

    Jay
     
  11. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    Our club has dues and 40 hours of work or pay @ $15 per hour. Your choice you work or you pay. Members who reach the age of 65 and have a certain number of years of membership are exempt.

    Some dictators do a great job. Finding one ain't easy. HMB
     
  12. all star

    all star TS Member

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    Most clubs rin very smoothly no matter if it is a one man run operation or a board run club if you don't like the club the way it is best thing to do is find another
     
  13. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    The very concept of Democracy is a fairy tale. Why would you expect it at a gun club? If you really want a say in what direction the club is going then you will have to make the transition from shooter to worker. A day here and there doesn't count. Its more like several hundred hours per year of unpaid time and you will miss out on a lot of shooting. Be careful what you wish for.
     
  14. 635 G

    635 G Well-Known Member

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    Since I started this thread--what do you think of the "Il Supremo" of his local club that calls the members a bunch of "old f---in fools", and at an annual awards get together did not mention the name of a recently departed club member who was a key player in the club. The key player maintained the trap machines & kept accurate financial records.

    Lou
     
  15. Rem870TB

    Rem870TB Active Member

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    "what do you think of the "Il Supremo" of his local club that calls the members a bunch of "old f---in fools"........etc."

    IMHO, according to that description, sounds like a horse's a$$.

    I have met mostly very good people in four decades of shooting but these types are around.
     
  16. N. J. BOB

    N. J. BOB Active Member

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    How about this for a thought. Membership fee $1,000.00 amortized over 5 years. Club dues $250.00 per year, with two work days required or if you don't want to put in the work days there is an assement of and additional $50.00 . Hire a full time manager and two additional laborers. Charge $4.00 per round for members practise and $6.00 for non-members. Fire away....
     
  17. Bisi

    Bisi TS Member

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    Our club is ran by the BOD and it is elected by the membership. The BOD elects the officers. All major decisions are voted on at the meetings once a month. That can be good or bad. Sometimes you need a quick decision, and if the meeting is 3 weeks away??

    If you want to change things get on the BOD. It is really not that hard. Clubs are all looking for new blood and help. All I did to get on was pull, score, load a trap house and roll up the cord every once in a while. When they asked me to run for the BOD, I thought they were kidding. Me??? Why me, because by rolling up that cord every once in a while is more work than 95% of the other members do.

    Hell they even made me an officer, and let me run the registered shoots. Believe me, it is not that hard to get on the board and make a few changes. The majority of the other guys on the board really don't want to be there either, it is just nobody else stepped up.


    If you want to change things be prepared to do the work yourself. We had a guy who wanted a "games" and "meat" shoot. I told him to bring it up to the board. He did and the board approved. Well he has the approval but we still do not have a "meat" shoot. Why because he wanted somebody else to run em. All he wanted to do was get the approval and not do the work to make it a reality.
     
  18. all star

    all star TS Member

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    You just don't know what to leave well enough alone do you? Hav you not caused enough hate and discontent with your comments. You could use some freinds about now instead of losing all of them. Wise up and learn to keep your mouth shut once in awhile you might benefit from it by listening once in awhile
     
  19. 635 G

    635 G Well-Known Member

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    Just because you shoot with some people, doesn't make them friends. When & if you're in trouble the people who you can count on & confide in are friends. I learned this the hard way. Some people will pimp them selves to feel important, or pimp themselves to make a few extra bucks & call their customers friends.

    Lou
     
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