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CLAY'S POWDER BLOOPERS

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by dan2116, Aug 3, 2009.

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  1. dan2116

    dan2116 Member

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    CLAY

    I was wondering if anyone has had a problem like I am having. My load is 17.5 - 17.8 of Clays powder in a Federal Gold medal plastic hull with Downrange 12S3 equivalent wad and Fiochi primer. I am having frequent bloopers with this load.I have looked in the barrel after the weak shell and it looks dirty and when one goes off strong it is clean. I load 17.5 - 17.7 of 700X with the same Gold Medal case , 12S3 Downrange wad and Fiochi primer with no problems at all and have shot many rounds of this combination. I check the powder charges frequently with the machine doing it's job ( Mec 9000 on a Automate). The wad seating pressure is close to the same for both loads as I set it to just move the gauge a bit ( aprox. 20lbs by the gauge). Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks all.
     
  2. Old Texas Marine

    Old Texas Marine Member

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    Cocked wads will cause "Bloopers" due to insufficient sealing of the barrel and consequent low pressures. Had it happen on RP hulls that I try to get too many loadings out of. The hull mouth is a bit too closed and hangs on the wad during loading.

    YMMV

    HBT
     
  3. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    What you describe sounds like an intermittent powder flow problem. I know you have been checking charge weights but the only way to verify this is to cut open a random sampling (at least 10%) from the blooper batch and weigh the charges. If that checks out okay then the next thing to check for is damaged wads due to broken wad guide fingers. You might get some clues about wad damage from the cut apart sampling. Last question mark would be is it possible there was some moisture in the hulls before you loaded them?
     
  4. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    Try some Winchester 209 primers and see if the problem goes away. HMB
     
  5. ou.3200

    ou.3200 Well-Known Member

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    What is the bore diameter of your gun? I have problems with bloopers in my .745 overbored barrel with some loads/wads.
     
  6. dan2116

    dan2116 Member

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    The shot charge is 1 1/8 and the wads are not cocked. The barrel is Wilkinson tuned with a 742 bore.The hulls are bone dry as well. I had tried this load in the wally and Estate hulls with the same problem and quit using for that reason but has fallowed me to the Gold Medal hulls.
     
  7. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    How about powder bridging? Are you using a baffle in your powder resevoir? Is the loader grounded? Loading in an air conditioned room? Hate to keep harping on the powder end of it but what you are desribing sure sounds like an under charge.
     
  8. ou.3200

    ou.3200 Well-Known Member

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    Some lower pressure loads with some wads just will not reliably seal the larger bores. Try a different wad and/or a load with higher pressure. The Duster and the Downrange Versalite wads have worked well for me in loads with lower pressures.
     
  9. Spanky

    Spanky Active Member

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    What primer are you using? Or did I miss that?
     
  10. Rick Barker

    Rick Barker Well-Known Member

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    I agree with "wolfram", sounds like your press is not dropping full charge of powder. This often happens because the charge bar is hanging up on its movement due to too much weight of the powder and shot bottles, or the bottles are too tight. Back both bottles off slightly. I would suspect you are using a tall bottle on the shot side.

    While other problems can contribute, such as a bad batch of primers, improplerly seated wads or shells loaded once too many times resulting in a poor crimp, it sounds like poor powder charging.
     
  11. wireguy

    wireguy TS Member

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    Yup. Get your hands on some Versalites and load them. They have a deep powder cup and seal straight wall hulls well. Bet your problem goes away.
     
  12. Quack Shot

    Quack Shot Active Member

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    Check your powder drops and if they are OK, try a different primer. The Federal 209A, Winchester W209, Rio G600, or even the Cheddite might work better than the Fiocchi. I've had problems with Fiocchi primers in cold weather and/or light loads. It's always a possibility that the wads aren't sealing well. That could be made worse by the light load and Fiocchi primer.
     
  13. Bernie K

    Bernie K Member

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    Check to be sure your charge bar is moving all the way to the left when you pull the handle. Watch the screw head to be sure it's going all the way.
     
  14. tj303

    tj303 Member

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    I had the same problem when I used Fiochi primers. When I went back to WW 209's the bloopers went away.
     
  15. skeeljc

    skeeljc Supporting Vendor Supporting Vendor

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    If the bar is not hanging up the problem has to be a damaged wad. Check your wad fingers. The automate will not let you feel the wad being damaged as it is pushed through the wad guide fingers.

    I have nothing against Downrange wads but try some real 12S3's and I do not mean Claybusters!

    Clays is not very critical as to wad seating pressure or crimp quality. A damaged wad is the most likely problem.

    Jim Skeel
     
  16. Chipmaker

    Chipmaker Active Member

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    I agree on the cocked wad is most likely the problem, unless you cut them open you would not know it. I had similar trouble and with a auto loader I would have a flaming shell pop out with a shell catcher catching it that gets your attention !! On my Dillion I make sure my wads are "blossomed" so there is no chance of petal folding which I believe can also cock the wad. I am now using Titewad powder and pay very close attention to my weight drops and wad integrity. Not saying your doing it but yanking and cranking the handle is sloppy reloading and the results will be sloppy loads at the range.
     
  17. wayneo

    wayneo Active Member

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    I agree with Wolfram, if it is not a wad or primer problem, some very slight static in the bottle can cause powder bridging. Wayne
     
  18. dan2116

    dan2116 Member

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    I found the problem was with the wad. I checked the diameter comparison between the Downrange wad vs. Claybuster and there is as much as .020 smaller (Downrange) than the Claybuster. Switched back to Claybuster and problem was solved. Did other comparisons of styles of Downrange and Claybuster wads and the same result of smaller diameter than the Claybuster. The Downrange wad works well for other people but not for me and others at my gun club. I am not out to blast Downrange just offering my experience with them for referance if anyone is having the same problem.
     
  19. dr.beav

    dr.beav Member

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    One thing I found out about Clays powder is that you cannot let it get real cold and expect it to go off -- you will get very soft sounding shots from Clays powder that is below freezing. the beav
     
  20. dan2116

    dan2116 Member

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    After changing back to Claybuster wads with Clay's powder the problem stopped. With the 12S3 Downrange I would get consistent weak shots. I measured the Downrange vs. Claybuster and the Downrange are smaller diameter by .020. I have also checked other styles of Downrange with Claybuster with the same result (Downrange are smaller diameter ) accept for the Windjammer Downrange clones but quite a bit liter in weight.Anyway , no more Downrange for me.
     
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