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Clay Dot, My first usage Vs Clays

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Neil Winston, Nov 27, 2009.

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  1. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    You can't "correct" like that as you have done with the 42 fps. There's no reason to think that the 1180 fps shells, through what I guess to be a full choke, aren't reading just what they should. That is, some pellets are going that fast. So just stick with your "uncorrected" readings; they are all you have, after all.

    But check the sentence

    "Now keeping the same 441 bushing switching to Clay Dot Weight changes to 17.4 Clay Dot Reload STS hull as above. Ave 1269 Hi 1296 Low 1206 ES 39 Sd 16 Corrected for the 42 fps changes average to 1227 fps"

    because I think there must be a mistake in there.

    Neil
     
  2. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    I learned to not over analyze and just load and shoot.

    16.8-17.2 grains of clay dot or clays...

    breaks birds, that what I want.

    Jim
     
  3. dverna

    dverna Active Member

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    You need to load 16.8 gr of Clay Dot to do your comparison. What makes you think they design burn rates with respect to bushing size?

    Bad mistake.

    Don Verna
     
  4. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    Dave- To me the term direct substitute would indicate that 17 grains of Clays would be equivalent to 17 grains of Clay Dot. The term would not suggest to me that the same bushing would drop equivalent weights of powder.

    Pat Ireland
     
  5. short shucker

    short shucker TS Member

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    Klay_Buster,

    The only thing that I can really glean from your data is the fact that ClayDot is denser than Clays.

    The bushing mearly determines the volume of the powder. It's density determines the weight of the charge. Yes you need to swith out to a smaller bushing to get the same charge.

    Marlon,

    I have run into that. Some powders are denser than others and by chance they use the same bushing. This will happen more often in a Mec because of the bore tolerances of the bushing isn't as tight as that of a Hornady, RCBS, etc. This doesn't excuse the need of weighing charges at the beginning of the run.

    ss
     
  6. Bob_K

    Bob_K Well-Known Member

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    Don't forget density changes from an older, already open can of powder vs. a newer, freshly open can of powder. Don't forget to roll the powder cans around so the the finer particles that have settled in shipment get re-integrated with the rest of the powder. There are lots of reasons you might get two different readings besides the fact they came from two different manufacturers. It all may be within lot to lot tolerances.
     
  7. slugbug1

    slugbug1 Member

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    This below is right off their web page. I have 8 lbs on the way, could't get clays except for 14 Oz. bottles.

    "Designed for competition shooters, Clay Dot™ is functionally and technically identical to competitive shotshell powders but at a reduced price. This American-made powder meters the same through reloading press powder bushings and functions with the exact same powder charge weights to achieve equal velocities and pressures. No need to change bushings or load data."
     
  8. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    slugbug1, doesn't that raise more questions than it answers? Meters the same, gives the same charge weights, identical speeds and pressures as . . . what? Competitive shotgun powders, I guess, but there's more than one, so I have to ask "Which?"

    Neil
     
  9. short shucker

    short shucker TS Member

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    slugbug1,

    They lied! Really makes you want to purchase their other products.

    ss
     
  10. perga1

    perga1 Active Member

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    I have had the same brand of powder measure that diffeently from one lot to another. I once got a Keg of 700X that was .8 heavier than the same powder from a different lot. It is a must that you weigh every keg of powder that is from a different lot as the last one you used (weighed). JRm
     
  11. Quack Shot

    Quack Shot Active Member

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    For a comparison of any meaning, you'd need to load the same charge weights of both powders. You also cannot make a comparison to factory velocities like you did. When using a chronograph with optical screens, there will be some deviation from the "true" velocity of the payload. You also cannot expect factory loads to be "right on the money" as far as velocity is concerned.

    Now for my take on the two powders. They are NOT the same. They are "similar" and you should not interchange data, nor should you assume that a particular bushing will drop the same weights of either powder or the same from lot to lot.
     
  12. slugbug1

    slugbug1 Member

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    When they say competitive shotgun powders I think they mean this..another quote from their web site: "Remarks: Designed to duplicates the performance of Hodgdon® Clays™ at an economical price." I'm only posting what I read, I don't have any direct experience yet, but I need to get it figured out before my powder gets here and I start using it. The Hodgdon site lists the following load for Clays: Remington hull, Win 209 primer, WAA12SL wad,1200FPS@ 17.0 grains and 7860 pressure. Clay Dot has it all the same except 1200FPS and 8200 pressure. That would lead me to conclude that if I drop 17 grains of Clay Dot with those components I'm good to go, and the rest of this is just conversation.

    If I blow myself up consider the above remarks invalid. Gary L.
     
  13. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    You'll be fine loading those with 17 gr Claydot.....

    Trust me,

    I stayed in a Holiday Inn last night...
     
  14. Quack Shot

    Quack Shot Active Member

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    slugbug1

    You should be fine with the load you listed. It's best to use Alliant data for Clay Dot and Hodgdon data for Clays. The two powders are similar, but not identical. They also may not use the same bushings for the same charge weights, even though the claim is that they should be the same. Check your drops and you should be good to go.
     
  15. slugbug1

    slugbug1 Member

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    Check them I shall. Is there still 20 gr. in a teaspoon? GaryL.
     
  16. Quack Shot

    Quack Shot Active Member

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    Level or heaping? :)
     
  17. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    I think I see the problem!!!
     
  18. glenn mcleod

    glenn mcleod Member

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    I load/shoot them both with the same PW bushing and one is 17.1gr. & the other 17.3gr. and I can't tell the difference. Both very good powders. Both crunch targets if I do my part. Glenn
     
  19. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    Same bushing?

    Sheesh, you have to be kidding. Better buy a scale.

    I once picked up a shell at the club, and not wanting to shoot it I took it home and cut it open. It had a nice heavy overcharge of 700X that just happened to fit in a #32 bushing.

    So I figure someone used the same bushing for REd Dot, and "tried" 700X.

    I don't want to shoot next to a reloader that doesn't have a scale.

    HM
     
  20. glenn mcleod

    glenn mcleod Member

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    I weigh approx. 1 shell out of each 100 I load, always have and always will. Glenn
     
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