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Cheaters

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Claymuncher, Nov 19, 2011.

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  1. Claymuncher

    Claymuncher Member

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    I was curious about how many cheaters are still turning down birds. Seen any lately or is this still a "Don't even go there" subject?

    CM
     
  2. APrice

    APrice Active Member

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    there...their...they're
     
  3. lboh

    lboh Member

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    Please explain what you are referring to. I don't understand what you mean by turning down birds and would like to understand if what I think someone has done to me is what you are referring.
     
  4. Old Cowboy

    Old Cowboy Active Member

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    We had one up here but he got nailed for embezzling. Insurance salesman, seems some of his client's premium payments wound up in his personal bank account. He doesn't shoot anymore, Apparently the state of Montana is more serious about enforcing their rules than the ATA?
     
  5. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    Gee, I thought this was about sex. Never mind!!
     
  6. halfmile

    halfmile Well-Known Member

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    Years back, at the Phoenix club I shot with a guy who ran 200. He did not shoot any hard angles, and must have turned down at least 60 or more.

    The "Late pull" excuse is gone, thanks to voice activation. good deal.

    HM
     
  7. Claymuncher

    Claymuncher Member

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    lboh : If you are really wondering, and it sounds like you may be putting me on but if not it is simple. If you call for a bird and you intentionally do not shoot it because it is either a hard angle of you did not see it correctly, you are cheating. Of course their lies (pun spelling alert) the grey area. Was it really a slow bird, a slow call or?

    Yea I will go there!
     
  8. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    Voice callers do not eliminate all slow pulls-just 99%!!
     
  9. Libra1310

    Libra1310 TS Member

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    I Think there is more sandbagging then anything else. I know a guy who has a A-AA average and won the C class at an event. Dont ask how the ATA let him shoot C class, but he did and won.
     
  10. APrice

    APrice Active Member

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    You get two FTF's, then it's a lost bird...right?
     
  11. lboh

    lboh Member

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    I wasn't putting you on and thought this is what was being referred to. Yes I saw it happen at a recent shoot. The scorer did call BS and noted as lost birds
     
  12. Claymuncher

    Claymuncher Member

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    oleolliedawg : You are probably right but I would guess 98%, and how much money is won or lost in the difference between a 98 and a 100 in a money Hdcp?
    You know a cheater never quits he just adapts to the enviroment.

    CM
     
  13. scooterbum

    scooterbum Active Member

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    "You get two FTF's, then it's a lost bird...right?"

    Are we taking into account paragraph C2?
     
  14. scooterbum

    scooterbum Active Member

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    Cheating practices are running rampant. Some are covert, some not.
     
  15. 3357

    3357 Member

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    A guy I shoot with used to always turn down 2 hard rights as fail to fires. He finally got called on it at a local registered shoot this fall under paragraph
    C2. Score keeper advised the target was legal and asked if his shell failed to go off. He did not pull the trigger. Score keeper advised target was lost and scored as such. He was upset but accepted score keepers call and has not turned down a target since.
     
  16. Stl Flyn

    Stl Flyn Well-Known Member

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    Who are they cheating? If they feel good about shooting better because they eliminated the tough birds, they only are cheating themselves. If you notice this happening, call them on it. Once they get the reputation for it they loose credibility pretty quick, and maybe develope a conscience.
     
  17. scooterbum

    scooterbum Active Member

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    Rick,

    I am not the squad police. Most times, I'm not watching other contestants. The scorekeeper, while usually inexperienced, has become complacent with the phony FTF. There's so many different types of crap in the ATA, that it is no wonder people are leaving.
     
  18. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

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    A fast or slow pull isn't a FTF, it's a no bird.

    A FTF occurs when a gun malfunctions, the shooter flinches or fails to pull or release the trigger. He's allowed 8 FTFs per hundred with 4 sub-events, 2 if shot 50 per trap.

    The shooter alone is the sole judge in determining whether or not a clay is fast or slow for his call. It's always been like that too. We may know better but that's the way it is and the games will continue. The rules state a shooter doesn't have to shoot either one and it's a no target.

    Hap
     
  19. RWT

    RWT Well-Known Member

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    Hap,
    I have to disagree with your last statement. The final dicision is for the scorer/refree then ultimately up to the club appointed judge.(unless the rule has been changed since I read the last rule book) and not all people consider a flinch a FTT.

    Robert
     
  20. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

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    Robert, you may want to check that one out a bit deeper? The scorer or refs decision IS the final word,,,, but,,, that's after the target is thrown. Not before?

    Hap
     
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