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Challenging the scorekeeper

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by Laserwizard, May 3, 2012.

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  1. Laserwizard

    Laserwizard Member

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    At a registered singles event this past Sunday one of the shooters in our squad questioned the scorekeeper when he called out that the shooter only hit 4 targets that round.

    I know for a fact that he hit all 5 because I watched them break.

    The squad leader stepped up and got rather nasty about it, and said that you can't invent your own score and that the scorekeepers word is final and if he said you only broke, 4, then your score will be 4.

    The score went down as 4 because of the squad leader, even though the rulebook clearly states you have the right to have any error corrected before firing the first shot of the next post.

    If you were the shooter, what would you have done in this instance?
     
  2. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    Wizard, you missed the part about the scorers decision is final?

    Your appeal should have been to shoot management..
     
  3. Laserwizard

    Laserwizard Member

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    BigM-You suggesting he should have brought it to their attention right then, or after we finished on that trap?
     
  4. mixer

    mixer Well-Known Member

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    You have to have it settled then & there before you start shooting on the new position. Once you're on the new post the score as marked on the sheet is final.

    Eric
     
  5. Hap MecTweaks

    Hap MecTweaks Well-Known Member

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    Before shooting the next post, it's time to call in managment to allow them to question the scorekeepers marked targets. Was there more than two of the shooters watching the target breaks? The more seeing the breaks the better when managment shows up!! Your squad leader was a peckerhead, write his name down and don't shoot on his squad again!!

    Hap
     
  6. BIGDON

    BIGDON Well-Known Member

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    You need to watch each others backs because to many scorers and shooters don't know the rules. If that had been my lost target I blieve I would have told the squad leader where he could put his shotgun.

    This was the right time to question the score and if the scorer didn't want to correct it then bring in shoot management. Squad leader has no real authority and is limited in duties.

    Don
     
  7. dhip

    dhip Active Member

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    I have to agree,The squad leader is not for defending the score keeper,he's to help out in this case.If others seen the terget break,as stated above the squad can ask for the overturn of the decision,if it cannot be settled in a gentlemen freindly atmosphere,call in the management for final decision.One person,whether squad leader or score keeper doesn't have the total right to the call,especially if the majority see's it differently.Just my 2C's

    Doug H.
     
  8. cubancigar2000

    cubancigar2000 Well-Known Member

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    Thats why the scores are called out before moving to the next post. Fix it then and there. Don is right, if other people seen it and agree then the scorekeeper should change it, if not get the Mgt but above all do not continue until it is resolved.
     
  9. BigM-Perazzi

    BigM-Perazzi Well-Known Member

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    4. Shoot Management shall appoint a judge or judges to be called upon for ruling on official complaints when the occasion arises. If a judge has not been appointed, the president of the club, or in his absence, the secretary shall act as judge. The referee/scorer must call upon a judge to settle any controversy regarding a score or when he/she has made an error by being ahead or behind in his scoring. Officials of the ATA will not change the decisions of these judges made in accordance with these Rules, or change the report of any shoot held in accordance with these Rules

    Sec III C 4 ATA RULEBOOK
     
  10. yakimaman

    yakimaman Well-Known Member

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    Cuban Cigar - I can't believe I'm the only one who can't hear a word the score keeper says. Take my hearing aids off, put my ear plugs in and I can hear the guns go off, but that's it. So what do we do, have the score keeper raise fingers to indicate scores on each post?
     
  11. Twinbirds

    Twinbirds TS Member

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    if you broke it you have every right to it, squad leader is no more than another person on the squad, he should want you to have your correct score no matter what. everyone on the squad should help by paying attention to targets being thrown and how they are scored. pullers are human and can make mistakes. lost should have been called when it was scored, then someone should have spoke up, if not question it before your next shot. get it straight in your head what the target status is before proceeding, having inner turmoil over a target can cost you birds.
     
  12. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    As an echo to cubancigar, that is why the scorer calls out the scores on each rotation. More importantly if there was a mistake on one shooter's score there may well be other mistakes if the scorer somehow got the sequence out of order. This is the time to review all the scores and correct as necessary.

    The good news is this doesn't need to be a nasty confrontation. Handle it with a smile and a calm voice and tell the scorer thank you when the correction is made.
     
  13. jdsfarms

    jdsfarms Well-Known Member

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    I have had this happen many times as squad leader and a consensus of the squad has always settled it on the spot to the satisfaction of all.Jerry
     
  14. dhip

    dhip Active Member

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    Had just the opposite happen to me last thursday.Scorekeeper had me run them,I thought for sure I missed one.As squad leader,and also for my own peace of mind I called everyone over after last round was fired.Aked them about the greenbird(that's the one I thought I missed),everyone to a t said a chip fell off the bottom.I just was so focused,if the bird didn't disintegrate I didn't see it.Now don't get excited,it was only 25 straight,and with a BT99 I'm trying out with intentions of possibly buying.

    Doug H.
     
  15. Ifitfliesitdies

    Ifitfliesitdies Member

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    Shooting a score of 4 or 5 targets at a registered shoot? Forget the 1 target, the squad leader and the scorekeeper. Schedule a lesson. It might be better to learn how to shoot before learning how to Challenge the score keeper.

    Just my opinion.
     
  16. minnship8

    minnship8 Well-Known Member

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    Ifitfliesitdies,

    I believe he was speaking of his score at a single post.

    Chip Porter
     
  17. Laserwizard

    Laserwizard Member

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    That's right, I was referring to the score he shot at that post. Actually there were two us us that said we saw him break all 5 on that post but it didn't make a difference.

    Thanks for all of the advice. Live and learn I guess. At least now we understand how to handle it.
     
  18. Auctioneer

    Auctioneer Well-Known Member

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    I didn't read all the posts.

    I have seen targets not break when shot but did break before hitting the ground. I called out DEAD BIRD after the scorer called a lost target. Because I called it and someone else backed me they marked it a dead bird.

    If you see a target break but the scorer calls a lost target then call out DEAD BIRD as fast as you can. Then ask others if they saw it. I will also say where the piece came from. 1:00, 7:00 and how big.

    If only the shooter calls a dead target then the rule of the scorer will hold up. That is just the way it is. The officals will do nothing because they weren't there.

    Be nice and don't fight with the scorer. That will hurt you more then you think. If others do back you up and the scorer refuses to change the score then be nice and ask for an offical. They have to then bring one in for the issue.

    Some shooters will fight for a target they didn't hit.
     
  19. rick979

    rick979 Active Member

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    squad leader means NOTHING
     
  20. BIGDON

    BIGDON Well-Known Member

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    try shooting without one.

    Don
     
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