1. Attention: We have put together a thread with tips and a tutorial video to help with using the new software. Please take a moment to check out the thread here: Trapshooters.com Tutorial & Help Video.
    Dismiss Notice

Build and they will come ---- NOT!!!

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by k newman, Jun 23, 2007.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. k newman

    k newman TS Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2006
    Messages:
    64
    Cardinal center is a beautiful place to shoot -- been there 3 times. Hopefully they learn how to run a shoot before going out of business.

    We just returned from a planned weekend trip to shoot the HAA this weekend for the state shoot. We never fired a shot, 6 hours of riding down and back.

    There is NOTHING in the program about cut off times or maximum number of squads.

    At 10:30 this morning we joined a line of about 15 shooters trying to squad up for today's singles -- no spots available -- why can't you just make 2-3 squads from here -- can't do that. One shooter had squadded on thursday, and waited until this morning to cashier - they had given his slot away.

    They were finding slots occasionally, but it no-shows on the line, so if something came open you were already late -- like OJ through the airport to make your trap.

    While standing in line, we find they had sold the calcutta on Friday night (last year it was on Saturday). A gentleman behind us had driven from New York, and like us, wanted to be part of the special event.

    Not needing the targets, we checked out vendor row and left, rather than incur the costs. The guy from New York was a bit ticked as well.

    Last year, they had 4 traps with lights and waited until 10:00 to shoot off singles (after the calcutta auction) -- never did post anything that night.

    Seems they ASSUME everyone stays all week, on the grounds and is available for every change they want to make.
     
  2. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    8,371
    Sounds like they had more people than they could handle and had to cut off the registrations which I have seen happen more than once ... This is probably one of those time you should of pre squaded to make sure you had a place on a squad ... You have a right to be upset, just at who is the question ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  3. The Rock

    The Rock Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,491
    The place was packed I mean there was a S*$t load of people there.. Some where around 1,200 entries (236 squads is the figure I heard)for the 200 target singles champion ship. There were 18 banks turning over fifty targets (five shooters)every 20-22 min it moved fast.

    They had a power outage yesterday , the whole area was down for quite a while. They had to finish the handicap that was interrupted from Friday before they could start the 200 singles.

    The ATA stopped Mr. Fishburn from putting any more traps in and limited him to 40. If enough people say enough the ATA may permit him to put in additional traps to handle the state shoot.

    There was plenty of time to register before hand. And people were registering when we got there at 8:00. Todays event that was to start at 8:00 didn't get under way till 10:00. This caused a two hour loss of target time for the event. Still there has to be a time to shut it off.

    The shooting went fast there were just a whole bunch of shooters.

    The owner will be starting on vendor buildings for next year also. And the vendors were way up in numbers from the first year.

    There was rain this year also and no mud just a lot of green grass.

    We left at 6:30 and they were about a hour & 1/2 from finishing up the regular program. Shoot offs ???????

    Ps;

    Birdtracker how did you do on the second hundred. Sorry we could not get together and chat but that's the way it goes sometimes.

    Rock

    Jim
     
  4. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    7,848
    Rock, I'm dead certain the ATA has _not_ limited the number of traps Mr. Fishburn has, or plans to, install.

    Neil
     
  5. phirel

    phirel TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    9,556
    Neil- I'm dead certain that you are correct. The ATA has neither the authority nor the mechanism to limit the size of any club.

    Pat Ireland
     
  6. k newman

    k newman TS Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2006
    Messages:
    64
    I'm not sure pre-squadding would have helped. I was standing in line with folks who's squads were given away because they hadn't cashiered.

    Vendor numbers were WAY up from last year -- on par, or maybe more than the PA state shoot.

    I heard the calcutta was half the amount of last year - bought in a professional auctioneer, auctioned 2 shooters at a time -- on Friday without giving the weekend crowd a shot.

    I'll voice my concerns with OTSA officials, for sure.
     
  7. j2jake

    j2jake Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    2,287
    Many can take a lesson from the folks at Robinson Ranch here in Florida. During the Spring Championships they too experienced a major power outage. They pulled out the generators and had the line back shooting in a very short order. I can tell you we at the Jacksonville club will have generator back-up available at our next major shoot as well. Jake
     
  8. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    8,371
    I cannot imagine the ATA would care how many traps they have much less have the powers to limit them to a certain number of traps ... The ATA and OSTA get daily fees from all the shooters and would probably want to be able to accommidate as many shooters as possible, sometimes for what ever reason that obviously cannot happen ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  9. Cherokee Kid

    Cherokee Kid TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    291
    If they would have shot 100 per field, they could have finished in under 9 hours. Shooting 50 and moving makes no sense.
     
  10. trpshtr2001

    trpshtr2001 TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    550
    To wait till the championship days to sign up is a problem, but do you blame it on someone else?
    I figured sooner or later SOMEONE would complain about something. It is a beautiful first class facility.
    Are you from Michigan by any chance ?
     
  11. mobear

    mobear Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    252
    trpshtr2001,

    If they are from michigan they would know how a shoot should be run at large facility, if they cant handle it on 40 traps they need to practice more.
     
  12. James L Balog

    James L Balog Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    285
    As for the singles on saturday my spot was also givin away, i was on squad 155 and i knew they had to finish the handicap from friday. i live an hour away there was no reason for me to be there at 10 in the morning when i knew i wasnt going to shoot until atleast 1. personally i dont like showing up hours early and standing around and waiting when it is not necasary. i have no problem with paying in early. i do have a problem with making an announcement at 945 that everyone has to be paid in by 1015. The spring grand in Tucson you have to pay in before 3 p.m. a day prior to the event, and if your not paid by then your squad is released. maybe the osta should consider that method of cashiering for next years shoot..

    James balog
     
  13. birdtracker

    birdtracker Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    1,203
    well I just got home and I am whipped. I got there saturday at 11:30 and got my new shotgun . So I immediately head to squadding, do not pass go, do not collect 200 dollars. I even didnt have time to talk to the "Rock" which I apolagize for that. I got the last post available period and paid at exactly 12:02 and it was shut down. There is alot of shooters and will only get bigger. If you are going and listen or write this down Pre squad and Pay. Pay for all when you get there so you dont have to go back thru the line. I paid for saturday and sunday. Hope everyone had a great time. Some of the Trapshooters.com people went out for dinner saturday night. Later. Don
     
  14. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    8,371
    I'm a little confused and wonder if the "Special Event" was posted in the program and when it stated the auction was to be held ..? Its not unusual to auction two shooters at a time if they have a lot of entries and that is usually stated as an option or a reserved right to change the program if the clubs management team feels its needed ... The amount of entries is also usually stated in the program as well as cashiering proceedures and deadlines ... If the club gets the amount of entries filled it would be unfair to the shooters who made sure they were squaded early enough to get in the scheduled program and would be frowned upon for the club to expand beyond that point even if they could of ... It sounds like Pre Squading and prepaying would of been in order to assure a place in the programmed shoot so things like this don't happen to those who preplan, pre squad, and prepay ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  15. Dusted1

    Dusted1 TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    86
    Cardinal Center is going to have to add 20 more traps to handle the crowds. Turning people away will only hurt them. They have the room to add to the trap line and it should be done. This place will only get bigger and better if they can handled the people who come to shoot.
     
  16. K-80 Jim

    K-80 Jim TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    109
    Wow, it was a great shoot and the facility is incredible. We did have some issues like the power outage that happened at least twice and I think it totaled about four or five hours. There were obviously more shooters than daylight and I think they handled it pretty well. Would you prefer for them to sell you a position that shoots after dark? You can't please everyone so you might as well take care of the ones that are there. What's wrong with cashiering the day before and eliminating some of the risk of losing your place. I would never suggest that you would do such a thing but some might hit a little rain on the drive over and decide not to come. There isn't anything more frustrating than waiting for a spot to open on a squad and then watching squads with empty posts. The truth is they got slammed, I saw some attendance numbers posted and I recall one event that was 11?? last year and 17?? this year.

    Shoot well and come early,

    Jim
     
  17. k newman

    k newman TS Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2006
    Messages:
    64
    The special event IS in the program for Sunday, no mention of the time of auction. There is also no mention of cut off for number of squads or entries closing.

    Do not misunderstand, I like Marengo -- great place, and relatively close -- I hope it booms.

    However, being turned away with no parameters around it, and excluded from participating in the event I'd been counting on for months - that's a problem.

    If anything were in the program -- entries close at 12:00, max of 200 squads, or special event friday night, and I missed it, no problem. but, when nothing is published, I see nothing wrong with showing up at 10:30 and expecting to shoot.

    I understand growing pains, and I understand adapting to difficulty, but for two years now, I've left with the distinct impression they believe everyone stays on the grounds -- ALL WEEK, and that's who they cater to. The saturday/sunday HAA shooters are non-existent.
     
  18. trpshtr2001

    trpshtr2001 TS Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    550
    K Newman........I agree with most of your concerns , especially the camper thing. Look at the past Grand and the present Grand, same thing. I think it is a trend in the shooting community to cater to the campers. I will bet that next year all of your concerns will be addressed. I'm sure it was an oversight.
    But isn't it a nice place, really nice.
     
  19. gcbluerock

    gcbluerock Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 1998
    Messages:
    168
    and where is this cardinal center place located???
     
  20. Dove Commander

    Dove Commander TS Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2007
    Messages:
    1,364
    I would not expect to show up at 10:30 and shoot in 2008. The facilty is great, it was a well run shoot, and they just got buried in entries. The power outage, which was regional (on the news) was the main problem. It happened at around 3:00 PM, so it would be impossible to notify people in the first event the following day. They elected to try to squeeze it in the following day. What would you do? Either way someone will be yanked off.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.