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Birther faces court martial for refusing orders.

Discussion in 'Politics, Elections & Legislation' started by Barrelbulge(Fl), Dec 14, 2010.

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  1. Barrelbulge(Fl)

    Barrelbulge(Fl) Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    Birther faces court martial for refusing deployment orders
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    EmailPrint.. AP – FILE -- In a Sept. 2, 2010 file photo Army Lt. Col. Terrence L. Lakin leaves the military courthouse … .By Jade Walker jade Walker – 2 hrs 44 mins ago
    The Starting Point is a snapshot of the news that occurred overnight and a preview of the stories we expect to cover today.

    Featured story ********

    A court martial proceeding against an 18-year Army veteran who refuses to deploy to Afghanistan will begin today at Fort Meade in Maryland.

    According to The Associated Press, Lt. Col. Terrence Lakin disobeyed orders to report to a Kentucky base earlier this year because he doubts whether President Barack Obama was born in the United States and questions his eligibility to be president. Click here to view the charges.

    Lakin served in Afghanistan, Korea, Bosnia, Germany, Honduras and El Salvador before taking up an occupational and environmental medicine residency in Maryland. In 2009, he became the chief of primary care at the Army's DiLorenzo TRICARE Health Clinic at the Pentagon. If Lakin is found guilty, he faces a dishonorable discharge, several years in prison and a forfeiture of his pay, which totals nearly $8,000 a month, CNN reported.
     
  2. Ross

    Ross Well-Known Member

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    Do you really think this would prove anything regardless of the outcome? Ross
     
  3. Robb

    Robb Member

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    Maybe not but the man's got stones. I do bet there is more to story.
     
  4. cbxchris

    cbxchris Active Member

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    It will all come out one day. Maybe not in our lifetime......
     
  5. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    Obama said he would be transparent, so much so, you can't see it! no matter what you are trying to uncover.
     
  6. Mike Hessong* (MH*)

    Mike Hessong* (MH*) Active Member

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    I never really like the term "birthers", I wish more people would call themselves what I feel is what we really want; the the TRUTH !!! I think "truthers" makes more sense, and I only hope that something would eventually come out to prove all of the "truthers" right. Like so many e-mails that we have all received, minutes after an incident involving some celebrity, the news services know EVERYTHING possible about ALL persons involved and have already talked with friends and family all the way back to their pre-school; but no one can find out any of Obama's school history or what name he went by or how he paid for his college or if his grants were legal or not !!
     
  7. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    He should go to prison. He signed up in the reserves evidently

    Regards to Iowa

    Gene
     
  8. sernv99

    sernv99 Active Member

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    this guy needs to go to prison....when you join the military, you follow orders, not question the person's true nationality giving the orders. If the US military became a "democracy", with personnel refusing orders at will, you would have a defunct military force incapable of carrying out anything.
     
  9. jagrdawger

    jagrdawger TS Member

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    The Nazi's said the same thing....just following orders.

    Bottom line is you are required to present a birth certificate to join the military!

    Should not the commander in chief have to present the same document? You also have to account for all places lived, all foreign travel, associations with certain categories of people and for unusual expenses or sources of revenue to receive certain security clearances. Mr. Obama has failed to do this by all accounts.

    There are two types of orders; legal and illegal. As a soldier you have the responsibility to obey the first and to refuse to obey the second. Often you do not have time to get a legal opinion on which are legal and which are illegal. It may be a gut decision that you have to defend if the giver of orders disagrees with you.

    A commander whose order is challenged has a responsibility to present the challenger with evidence as to why his/her order is not illegal if there is time to do so and there is at least some credible reason for the challenge to exist.

    If you think this doctor is a rare exception, he is rare only in his willingness to take a stand. I have yet to hear a single officer privately express a belief that Mr. Obama has mat the legal requirements for the office he occupies. I have rarely see such unanimity in the officer core on a single subject. The reason there is not a mass uprising is that we understand the consequences of having Mr. Obama exposed would likely be civil unrest at best and most likely a civil war.

    I am not an outsider looking in on the military. I am active duty with 20+ years of federal service as an officer who has challenged an illegal order. This is just one of several reasons I will soon be dropping my retirement paperwork.

    Saying, "...I was just following orders..." is an abdication of ones moral and legal responsibility as is the phrase "...when you join the military, you follow orders, not question the person's true nationality giving the orders...". By this logic we should turn our military and taxes over to the UN if they tell us to since we should not question who they are. Our oath to follow orders is preceded by the phrase "...that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign or domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same...". The problem arises when trying to define the domestic threat. Is turning a blind eye to a potentially unconstitutional situation in the highest office of our country bearing true faith and allegiance????

    To date no one has proved that Mr. Obama is legally authorized to hold the office of president. Rather, the courts have only affirmed that he cannot be removed by refusing to allow the challenges to proceed. This has essentially been an acquittal by lack of evidence rather than any declaration that he is legally authorized to hold the office. In this case the courts have refused to make the defendant produce potentially incriminating evidence.

    I am not an outsider looking in on the military. I am active duty with 20+ years of federal service as an officer who has challenged an illegal order. This is just one of several reasons I will soon be dropping my retirement paperwork.
     
  10. Baron23

    Baron23 Well-Known Member

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    I don't really give a fig whether we should or should not have to have the incoming President of this country present a birth certificate or not.

    The fact is that this fella is a military officer who refused a lawful order from his superior officers and was essentially AWOL from his new duty assignment. He can have all the political views he wants, on his time. On the military's time, he needs to obey lawful orders.

    Reference from this situation to Nazi's just claiming they were doing their job is ludicrous.
     
  11. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    He actually missed a movement to combat

    Hope he gets a bigtime prison term

    jagrdawger - I dont see how you are an active duty military officer- what you say doesnt track--- Even a private on active duty knows better. It is clear that Mr. Obama is the commander in chief. It is also clear that he didnt personally order this bag of shit to do anything.

    regards from Iowa

    Gene

    PS there was a time not long ago where this POS could have been shot
     
  12. sernv99

    sernv99 Active Member

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    well I too was prior military, in an Army airborne infantry unit about 10 years ago, enlisted, and if anyone pulled this kind of garbage, they would get their ass handed to them. This kind of b.s. does not make for an effective fighting unit. If military personnel are allowed to challenge the commander in chief and get away with it, then you are going to have major discipline problems down the road with other personnel whining about the most frivilous crap and ignoring their chain of command.
     
  13. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Someone PM me the name of this jagrdawger poster please- and where he is from

    I think he is impersonating an officer of the Armed Forces. A federal felony.

    I want to forward his name and location to the appropriate federal prosecutor.

    Barrelbulge the originator of this thread tried to sell a 45 online right here for $8000 dollars claiming this old beat up 45 that someone had ground the serial number off of was a "black ops" weapon didnt he?

    Anyone see some common motive here?

    regards from Iowa

    Gene
     
  14. Catpower

    Catpower Molon Labe TS Supporters

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    Jagerdawger had better watch out Gene Nosco the lawdog from Earlham Iowa is out to get you LOL
     
  15. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Catpower if he is impersonating a military officer- it will be the federal prosecutors that get him and rightfully so.

    Not much lower.


    With what he posted an army private would know better and the way he posted it, just doesnt seem even close to military- know what I mean



    Regards from Iowa

    Gene
     
  16. shelly

    shelly TS Member

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    I don't know why Gene is making such a wild accusation, but a lot of what jager said is exactly true. Where he's wrong, IMO, is that the deployment order doesn't come from the President, so it's perfectly legal no matter whether the President should or shouldn't hold that office. I guarantee you that his deployment orders aren't signed by Obummer himself.

    In essence, the status of the Presidents birth certificate or where he was born is irrelevent to deployment orders and the order is perfectly legal.
     
  17. jagrdawger

    jagrdawger TS Member

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    Well,

    Did I ever say that he had not violated orders? No, I did not.

    He has clearly violated orders and is wrong to do so. Should he be punished? Sent to Leavenworth? If the courts martial deems it so, then yes. Should he be punished? Yes, I never said what he was doing was right. Do I agree with his methods? NO! But, that does not make the question go away.

    Do I think every member of the military and EVERY citizen of the United States has a right to expect our president to prove he is legally qualified. YES!!

    Did Mr Obama sign his orders, of course not. Did his policies cause the need for those orders? Maybe. It does not change the fact that the presidents orders to the SecDef do in fact affect every military member directly as well as indirectly. Bearing on this case questionable, but where then does the case lie that can make Mr Obama prove his eligibility?

    I know that every officer, warrant, NCO and enlisted member has to prove they are eligible to serve and must provide a birth certificate BEFORE they swear in. I am surprised that so many people on this forum are so willing to give Mr Obama a pass on proving his eligibility.

    I find it very interesting that there have been similar cases to this where the military dropped the court martial for the apparent reason that that was the only way to make the subpoena requests for the birth certificate go away. This time the judge just said it could not be admitted as evidence.

    He has chosen to "martyr" himself much as people do who chose to challenge other laws. He will probably write his book after he is released from Leavenworth, but there might not be much to read since the pentagon will probably redact it heavily as they do anything that they do not agree with even when there is no national security threat. Unfortunately, this does give the military a black eye. And as anyone knows who has served in the military, we protect the constitution, but in many cases are not protected by it.

    Mr. Obama has spent nearly $2 million dollars hiding his history. Only a court is going to uncover it and only when they have a good reason to do so. An ordinary citizen should be able to ask that a president with dubious credentials prove that he is legally eligible to hold the office, but our courts have said that a citizen has no right to do this.

    It is clear that Mr. Obama holds the position of Commander-in-Chief, that is not disputed. Many doctors have held the title of MD and preachers the title of Rev. That too was not disputed until someone questioned, dug for evidence and found the quacks among the medical and clergy ranks.

    I do not like to see the military politicized, but the reality is that it is extremely political. Many policies in the military have only been overturned after someone refused to be told that because they were subordinate that they should be quiet and go away.

    I do not see how an American citizen can say he does not give a fig about our constitution, about whether our president is legally eligible. My issue is not whether this officer is guilty, he has admitted that he is guilty. My issue is that our country has forgotten the importance of out constitution and hold true to it.


    Gene - nice picture of you with LTG Hagenbeck, I served in the 10th Mountain with him and with COL Johnson in the 2/15th FA. I'm not a ring knocker, they are too political for my taste, but I did get commissioned in '90 as a Cyclone and I grew up not far from Earlham. I was a Road Runner. The fact that I do not use my name is a matter of my choice, not to hide my thoughts. Identity theft cost me thousands and a local Iowa sheriff refused to investigate because he thought it was be to expensive or time consuming and he did not have qualified personnel. I therefore try to limit the exposure of my name on the web.
     
  18. H82MIS

    H82MIS TS Member

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  19. Baron23

    Baron23 Well-Known Member

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    "does not give a fig about our constitution"

    What you just posted, quoted above, and what I posted, are not the same words. Work on it.
     
  20. g7777777

    g7777777 TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    OK jagrdawger thanks for clarifying

    Barrel Bulge- yes you did try to sell that 45 on here claiming it was a black ops 45- lmao-- then blaming you were told it was--- what a ripoff artist

    Barrel Bulge- you should have thanked me for stopping you in your tracks when I did- with that non serial numbered weapon

    Got it from a police officer? uh huh and I bet wherever you got it- it came really cheap- under 200 bucks? $200 - $8000 would have been a good take- maybe enough for you to take a trip to Washington and meet and greet with Mr. Obama-

    Hopefully that guy will be in prison so long that no one will care by the time he gets out.
     
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