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Beretta Release Triggers Question

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by prairiedog, Sep 16, 2008.

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  1. prairiedog

    prairiedog Member

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    I just recently had my 682 Gold E converted from pull to double release (couldn't pull the trigger on the second bird of doubles). Now I'm trying to learn to shoot the double release for doubles and I'm having problems to say the least. Besides doing a few ba-bangs, just one bang, and other assorted brain farts, I can't seem to reliably set the trigger for the second shot.

    The Beretta seems to have a lot of travel in the trigger for the set (at least a quarter inch). This translates, at least for me, into a set and release for the first shot but I don't seem to release enough to allow the trigger to fully travel forward for a set on the second shot. So I wind up with a set, call for the bird, release bang, dead bird, set trigger for second shot, swing to bird, release and no bang, d***, set again, flinch and drop barrel, swing wildly at rapidly falling bird, and release bang, with barrel nowhere near the bird. I'm sure it's hilarious to watch, but it ain't no fun from my point of view.

    I can and have done it correctly with the double release (2 or 3 rounds with only two brain farts) with about the same timing as when I used a pull, so I know I can conquer this eventually. But have shot an equal number of rounds with 10 to 15 brain farts.

    Is it just me or is it the Beretta trigger? Am I just double release challenged?

    When I shoot league Thursday, I plan to ask a veteran release shooter to shoot my gun to see if he has similar problems.

    Any advice would be appreciated. The way it stands now, I won't be shooting any registered doubles anytime soon.
     
  2. Beretta687EELL

    Beretta687EELL Well-Known Member

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    I think you are wise to have someone else familiar with shooting a double release try your trigger. That person will be able to determine if it is you or the trigger. I recently switched from a pull trigger to double release and it took some time to get used to it. It should be automatic and you should not have to make a conscious effort to set the second trigger. If the trigger is OK, just keep shooting it. Bill Malcolm
     
  3. esoxhunter

    esoxhunter Well-Known Member

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    I agree with Bill. I had almost given up on the release/release concept. It does take time to adjust to setting that trigger for the second shot. I am starting to get used to it, but it's taken a lot of patience on my part, (which I have very little of), and a lot of shooting. As Bill states, assure that the trigger is functioning correctly and then just keep shooting it. Believe me it will come. If you ever hunted with a pump action gun you know that you don't make a conscious effort when pumping a fresh shell into the chamber. Same way with resetting the trigger for the second shot. Many years ago I watched the Hall of Famer Vic Reinders shoot doubles with his Model 31 Remington with a release trigger. Shooting doubles with a pump gun with a release trigger would make one want to drink!! "Repetition is the mother of all skills". Good luck. Ed
     
  4. Dickgshot

    Dickgshot Well-Known Member

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    You might try a heavier trigger spring. It may be that your "set" weight is too light. Five pounds is standard, but mine is set a 7 pounds. That will give a more positive release on your first shot.

    Also, you can have an adjustable overtravel stop installed that doesn't require any filing on the sear. On the 391 trigger, some gunsmiths install a set screw in the back of the trigger guard to restrict the trigger travel. I would think that would work on your gun.
     
  5. Soot Them All

    Soot Them All Active Member

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    Location:
    corn patch IL.
    Prariedog, I'm was wondering who did you have convert the trigger????????, I as you have done recently went to a double release in my DT-10 and it does take a while to get the hang of setting the second. I try to set the second trigger as soon as the first goes off, if you wait the barrel has alot of bounce and you will have trouble hitting the second target. You didn't state what poundage the new triggers are, and a 1/4 inch of travel sounds like alot, I wish I could shoot it once to tell you what is happening. Good Luck Steve F...
     
  6. prairiedog

    prairiedog Member

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    Thanks for all the replies and advice. Phillip Crenwelge did the triggers. I've only been shooting the gun since the 13th. Shot poorly at league tonight. In addition to the 2d shot of doubles problem, I have also had several instances of setting the trigger for singles and when I release, the trigger does not move. I can then break the gun open, take the shell out, close the gun and dryfire without a problem. Shell back in, close the gun and the gun goes bang at the appropriate time. Very frustrating.

    I asked the club manager, who is a long time release trigger shooter, to assess the triggers. He says there is nothing wrong with the triggers, it's the butthead pulling the triggers who has the problem. For singles, he tells me I'm not cocking the trigger when I open the gun, thus the set and no release. Tells me to open the gun with more authority. For doubles, he thinks it is one or both of the following problems. He says the PFS stock I have is not set stiff enough and the 2d shot isn't cocking the triggers (inertial, don't you know). I'll adjust a couple of turns stiffer tonight. He also says I'm not releasing the trigger fully for the 2d shot. I am probably "trapping" the trigger before it can return to full travel for the set. He's probably right. Says I should also move the adjustable Beretta trigger from full back to full forward position. That's counterintuitive, I know, but he says many folks with adjustable triggers do that for a better release and it works well for them. He did the same with his gun. What do you think?
     
  7. Big Jack

    Big Jack Well-Known Member

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    You are not unique to the dreaded double release problem. This is my first attempt at a double release and I find the same problems you mention. If you use the gun for singles & 'caps, try putting a spent case in the second barrel and setting it after the first is fired. My doubles average is returning SLOWLEY..I can usually count on three or four ba-bangs as you describe them but all mine seem to be when moving the gun to the right. It'll work, eventually, I hope!
     
  8. Hauxfan

    Hauxfan Well-Known Member

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    Prairedog, I used to have a Gold E with double releases.

    One thing you might look for is...........There isn't much room between the hammer/release mechanisms and the wood of the stock.

    Take you stock off and see if the hammers might be rubbing a little bit on the wood, which would/could cause them to hang up a little. Mine was.

    I took a Dremel tool and relieved it where it was rubbing and presto, problem solved.

    I hope it is something as simple as this. It does sound like it because of what you said about sometimes the trigger doesn't go off on the first try.

    Good luck and hope you get it figured out.

    Hauxfan!
     
  9. esoxhunter

    esoxhunter Well-Known Member

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    Hauxfan has good input. I am planning on having my Beretta 682 converted to release/release. I called Skeets Gun Shop ; as they installed the bottom release on my 682. (I was very pleased with his workmanship and customer service). I talked to Dean and asked if I could just send him the trigger assembly. He said that would be OK if I was able to relieve the stock, after he did the trigger work. I said no and would send him the stock and the trigger group for completion of the job. ( I should have had him do the release/release in the first place instead of leaving the top barrel a pull). Bottom line, if you have the ability to do the modification on the wood; go for it. If not, let the professionals do it. Ed
     
  10. prairiedog

    prairiedog Member

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    Hauxfan/Esoxhunter,

    I shot 300 registered targets today, 200 singles and 100 handicap. I used the O/U barrels, shooting bottom barrel to see if the problem was only with the top single release. Didn't have a single problem for 200 shells. Was shooting fed papers that were on their 4th reload so just kicked them loose after shooting. That should have eliminated any "not cocking triggers" issues. But on the handicap event, I had 2 FTFs each for the first three rounds, then five FTFs on the last round. In each case, the trigger set normally but wouldn't release (trigger didn't move from the set position when released; I clearly felt and heard the trigger set on each FTF).

    I'm hoping that you are right and that the triggers are just binding/catching on the plastic (new PFS). It was cooler/cloudier earlier in the day for the singles but much warmer during the handicap event so maybe heat (from sun and from shooting) is causing some expansion, then binding?

    Until I got release triggers, I wouldn't have believed how much the gun not going bang could screw with you mentally. Shot my worst singles and handicap scores of the season (anticipating NOTHING HAPPENING, if you can believe that).

    After I get this problem fixed, it is going to take several flats of shells to get my confidence back. Its hard to shoot good scores if you lack confidence in your gun and your ability.

    I'm going to take the stock off the PFS tonight and check for signs of binding. This is all new to me so any help in where to look and what to look for would be appreciated.

    I still plan to take it back to Phillips for him to check out, even if I find and relieve areas of binding.
     
  11. prairiedog

    prairiedog Member

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    Soot Them All,

    I don't know what poundage the triggers are set for. I just told Phillip that I shot a friend's K-80 with factory releases and broke 24 first time out with release. Asked him to set it to K-80 factory specs. When they work, it feels great, nice and crisp. Several veteran release shooters, after trying them, have commented that Phillip did a good job on them.
     
  12. Easystreet

    Easystreet Well-Known Member

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    Prairiedog,

    If you are SURE that you are setting the trigger and it doesn't fire when you fully release it, then something is either binding the hammer/release mechanism or else the release is in need of an adjustment.

    BTW, that is a VERY dangerous situation you described since the trigger has already been pulled and released and only God knows when the hammer is going to fall. So keep the gun pointed in a safe direction.

    If the problem is when firing the second barrel, here is how to tell if the problem is you or the gun. If the second barrel doesn't fire when the trigger is fully released, then pull and release the trigger again. If it fires this time, then it was probably shooter error. If it won't fire the second time, then it is almost certainly something wrong with the gun.

    Easystreet
     
  13. prairiedog

    prairiedog Member

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    Easystreet,

    I agree 100% with you about the situation where the trigger has been pulled and released but no bang. It scares the hell out of me every time it happens. I DO keep it pointed in a safe direction until I can break it open but am paranoid that it will go off as it is being broken open. That's one of the reasons why it has destroyed my mental game (and my scores with it).

    In shooting doubles, the gun has never failed to shoot when I set and release the second time (3 times total) on the second shot of doubles. So I guess it is me and I just need to learn how to set and release correctly for doubles.

    Tomorrow I'm going to ask another release shooter to shoot the gun for singles and doubles. If it malfunctions with him, I'll know its the triggers not me. If he has no problems, then its back to me being the problem.
     
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