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Beginner's Trap Gun

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by ZELMO1, Jun 2, 2008.

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  1. ZELMO1

    ZELMO1 TS Member

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    I recently saw that H&R is making a trap model( Topper Trap Model ). I was wondering if anyone has any input on it. I am starting an SCTP trap team and it would be a good starter gun for my young shooters if is a good gun. I have an ultra slugger and it is a real shooter. No frills but it functions flawlessly. I am not a name brand snob so any input would be helpful. Thanks, Al
     
  2. ffwildcat

    ffwildcat TS Member

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    it would not be my 1st choice - LOTS of recoil.

    get a semi auto and go from there.
     
  3. Big Al 29

    Big Al 29 TS Member

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    BT 99

    Best beginner gun out there.
     
  4. Michael Jobe

    Michael Jobe TS Member

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    H&R is a poor choice due to it's light weight. It is going to kick, a LOT. Best choice really depends on the age of the kids you're going to work with, and their physical maturity. First off, are they going to be able to handle the weight of a 8 to 9 lb 12 ga? If so, then the BT99, Remington 870 & 1100, and Beretta 390 & 391 are all good, affordable, choices. If they can't handle the weight of a 12 ga, then a 20 ga. auto like the 1100 or Browning Gold is your next step. Forget about a 20 ga pump. It will kick them too much. If they can't handle the weight of a 20 ga. auto, they're not old enough to shoot trap.

    ~Michael
     
  5. fdiesel

    fdiesel Member

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    I would try to find an old Browning Broadway. It won't beat them up and is applicable to all disciplines.
     
  6. littlebear

    littlebear TS Member

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    For what it's worth I do not like any exposed hammer guns. Young shooters have enough to deal with without having to cock a hammer.
    DTD
     
  7. Phil E

    Phil E TS Member

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    You've probably already done this, but how about contacting folks in the local SCTP net, or asking the national group? Their website has a forum with discussions, and this could be one of the more-discussed topics? Phil E
     
  8. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    Another vote for an 1100.

    Or a Beretta 390, 391, or 3901.
     
  9. BDodd

    BDodd TS Member

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    Our youth chairman bought one of these in 20 ga and added some 9 ounces or so to the stock and a layer or two of pad to the comb to raise the poi. That took the extreme mis-balance away and several of us found it shoots quite easily and intuitively. I tried 3 shots myself and relied on focus-on-the-bird-and-let-the-gun-do-it's-thing for the first two which were smoke balls but tried to consider sight picture on the third and missed eloquently. He fed it nice easy reloads also and seems prepared to start the smaller and least physical with the gun.....Bob Dodd
     
  10. wolfram

    wolfram Well-Known Member

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    The exposed hammer is an extremely poor choice for the novice shooter. Cocking the gun is needlessly difficult and uncocking (without an AD) is usually more than they can handle. Add to this the problem of a light gun and high recoil levels.

    Used M1100 Remingtons are the way to go here. Spend a couple hundred $ more and get decent equipment. If and when you are done helping young people learn how to shoot, you can sell the M1100s for about what you paid for them.
     
  11. slide action

    slide action Well-Known Member

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    Probably NOT your best choice. Decocking the hammer might be a problem and their light weight probably would increase felt recoil. There is enough to think about on the line without the hammer. 350 bucks will get you a good used 870 and for 150 or so more, you can get a decent 1100. Both are good starter guns for trap. Once you come into your own and stash away enough money, you can look for a good used O/U gun. Just my thoughts.
     
  12. redhawk44

    redhawk44 Member

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    Get a used 870.

    Even a feild gun will do and once the scores get into the 90s, either put a trap stock on it, or buy a regular trap gun.
     
  13. missemucho

    missemucho Member

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    I've had hundreds of youth shooters come thru our club in the last two years (Arkansas Game & Fish now has the largest single youth trap program in the country) and have seen them try to shoot almost every conceivable shotgun. By far the ones that do the best and stick with the program shoot gas autos. I'm a big fan of the 1100 for cost effectiveness but AG&F bought a hundred of the square back Beretta's and the kids shoot them well.

    Cheap single barrels are a good way to discourage young shooters, in my opinion.
    John
     
  14. leadspreader

    leadspreader TS Member

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    24str8 that pic looks like a mule leg!
     
  15. Rollin Oswald

    Rollin Oswald Active Member

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    Al,

    Depending on the age (more accurately, the size) of your SCTP kids, in addition to the recoil a gun has (the 1100 is a good choice), any gun you choose is unlikely to fit any but the larger kids.

    For smaller kids, guns designed for adults are often too heavy in the barrel and all will have stocks that are too long in addition to combs at the wrong height and butts that are too big/high.

    Finding one gun that will decently fit all the kids may be a real challenge. You want them to continue being interested in shooting shotguns but to do that, they require some shooting success. For that to happen, the guns they shoot must fit them, at least fairly well.

    A stock with a length that fits the smaller kids can be lengthened with a slip-on recoil pad. The height of the stock's comb will be a major challenge. Kids, like the rest of us, need a comb at a height that will allow us to put snug cheek pressure on the comb while allowing the eye to look slightly down onto the rib.

    Things can be stuck onto the comb to raise it but they would need to be easily adjustable in height. Some of the models available, although somewhat clunky, may allow the comb to be adjusted in height without too much tinkering and without the need to have an adjustable comb installed at $200 to $250, which would be the best way to go.

    The goal is to provide a gun for kids of different sizes that they will be able to shoot reasonably well with instruction and practice but without excessive recoil that can quickly dampen their enthusiasm.

    Rollin
     
  16. Tripod

    Tripod Well-Known Member

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    Iowa man!!
  17. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    A used 1100 is the gold standard, and is very affordable.
     
  18. Phil E

    Phil E TS Member

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    As usual, Rollin hits the nail on the head. How small will your smallest be? The little 21" 20-GA Rem 1100-Youth is a wonderful starter gun, but even it is muzzle-heavy for little people, and the forearm doesn't come back as far as short arms want. With a 26" LT-20 barrel, my wife just loved it for a starter gun, as did a 10-year-old friend. But for small people like him, even its forward weight makes for awkward shooting, left-elbow-on-belt-buckle for support. Look at the Mossberg Bantam pump: they mounted the forearm back where short arms can use it. Smart idea. A friend started his son & daughter on the Bantam successfully. But one size just won't fit all. Phil E
     
  19. slide action

    slide action Well-Known Member

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    While you will not see many exposed hammer guns at ATA shoots, there is certainly NOT any rule against them in the ATA rule book.
     
  20. CalvinMD

    CalvinMD Well-Known Member

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    Go right to a nice slightly used K-80 or a Silver Seitz...its the most economical choice in the long run

    Let me Explain:
    !) you get hooked on trap
    2)You use your 1100 well winning league trophies and a few bucks to boot
    3)The guy who usually beats you by a couple of targets has a BT99
    4) You figure if you sell the 1100 and invest a few hundred more,..that a shiny new BT and surely the club championship will yours for sure
    5)You advertise the 1100 for 600(what you paid for it) but you get humiliated and beat down in price by someone on TS.com and end up losing 250 in cash value paid the shipping costs and FFL fees for the new owner....net return is a 250 dollar net profit (WoW)
    6)You go to buy your new BT99 at BassPro (100miles and $45.00 for fuel in the Suburban)..armed with your $250 from the 1100..Some discount coupons..and yes! a credit card(only 24% interest)...
    7)At BassPro..there it is (TADAA!!!)a beautiful shiny new BT99..You have them box up the prettiest one and (3hrs later after they found someone to do the paperwork)its off to the cashier with your prize and 3 flats of new AA's to practice...You pull out your cash and you find it just covers the ammo ...the Discount coupons don't help because they were from Dick's(damn!)..$1400 now on the credit card...but never the less you're on your way home..($65.00 more in gas, because you left your credit card in all the excitement)..you left home at 9am and arrive home at 7pm...too dark and too tired to do anything else...do fanciest footwork ever seen to slip new gun ( in gigantic black box with Browning plastered proudly in bright Gold)into the house past wife
    8)After a week of honey-do's and trips to the shoe stores to throw your wife off the trail..you finally get to unsheath your prize...everyone gathering to check it out..and you take the line for the first time...shot 4 rounds and your average is down almost 15 targets...uh oh! the pattern board says you are shooting your pattern left of the target..Looks like some fine tunability is needed in the form of an adjustable comb ( Mr. BassPro couldn't even pronounce adjustable comb let alone tell you why you might have wanted to purchase the model that already had it)...darn!..my rival doesn't need one to shoot HIS gun good!
    9) OK!! after 2 weeks and $200 you have your gun back and the other guys help you get dialed in...with lots of practice and some competition under your belt you're shooting mid 90's...a few months and you're doing great and you are only $1800-$1900 in the hole..( the 24% credit card balance has been lowered $8 dollars after 3 minimum payments)
    10)You win your league the next year after being pushed to using a release trigger by your massive flinch( another $350),..you are hooked bigtime like Charlie the Tuna...wow Doubles looks really fun!!!...I wonder if the credit card can handle an XT..wow and it comes in a combo!!!...wonder if I can get $900 for the BT99??? HERE WE GO AGAIN!!

    Y'all see where this is going don't you?
     
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