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ata press release

12K views 168 replies 25 participants last post by  V10 
#1 ·
On the ATA website is press release regarding an extra $100,000 added to the Grand American for 2012. Is this where the xtra ATA fees are going? Just curious where the money is coming from?
 
#102 ·
Joe,

Would you show me where you shoot out of State????

You have shot 100 registered targets this year(2012) at Columbiana County F&G Protect Assn. Last year(2011) you shot exactly 100 registered targets at Knox Township Sportsmans Club. Those are both in Ohio. Before that we have to go back to 1996 to see any registered targets. Unfortunately no records were posted for those years on back. So in that 15yr span I can't see where you have traveled anywhere. So that point of yours just flat makes you a hypocrite. That said, what does it matter where someone registers their targets?
 
#103 ·
grn...

I am sorry you can not find the information on the ATA's computer system.

But as you stated:

"That said, what does it matter where someone registers their targets?"

You have said you have never shot out of state. Of course this is a great opportunity for you being that you are from Illinois. With this compulsory purse you will now be able to shoot for money from out of state venues.

The more ata targets that are thrown in the heartland of trapshooting the better the chances of you winning some out of state monies. Of course that is only because everyone has to donate to the 9 event purse every day they shoot throughout the summer. And those monies are going back to your state.

I understand your agenda.

Unfortunately for you the ATA has rules against compulsory purses and I think this will be reversed.

You have to opportunity to appeal to your delegate. State your case that you think you have a right to those compulsory donations. It seems V10 gave a modest effort.

Your insults probably won't help your cause.

Best of luck
 
#104 ·
"You have to opportunity to appeal to your delegate. State your case that you think you have a right to those compulsory donations. It seems V10 gave a modest effort."

Just curious but what "Donations" are you referring to. If is your daily fees they are not donations. According to you they are a compulsory purse!!!!

Roger C said and he seems to agree with you.

"There is no hope for some of you. No mater how you cut it, all shooters that support the ATA are paying into the $100,000. But only the ones playing the purse are benefiting from it. If all shooters were ellegable to have a chance at the $100,000. then it would be fair to all."

This isn't a correct statement either. As an example the daily fees also pay for ATA state shoot trophies. I live on the east coast and those trophies are paid to west coast States as well as east coast states. Yet I don't have chance of winning those in California

Now wouldn't that be what you call "You might be paying $100 but you are getting into someone else's pocket by doing so." It all comes from the same compulsory purse you are talking about!!!!! You need to do a lot more thinking about you wild claims before you open your mouth and stick your foot in it.

Bob Lawless
 
#105 ·
Bob

When I wasnt' shooting trap I wasn't telling you how unfairly you are treating others in a sport I wasn't competing.

I understand you live on the east coast. I understand you can't win any of the prizes offered on the west coast. The trophies pale in comparison to $100,000.00 The biggest reason you can't win the trophies is you dont shoot trap. Get your own boot out of your mouth.

There are others that will not have a chance to compete for their own monies. And they shoot ATA targets.

You are right that all person that shoots in the ATA must pay into the purse. That makes it compulsory.

The ATA has a rule about this:

SECTION VIII PURSES AND OPTIONS A. COMPULSORY PURSES No compulsory purse and/or option of any type shall be permitted in any tournament in which ATA trophies or ATA added monies are provided.

Those shooters should have notice as to where their money is going. They have a choice. They don't have to shoot ATA targets. I started another thread to tell them that. But, I also said I would find a way to support my local clubs. That is something the ATA has forgotten.

As you say the mandatory fees that go into the purse aren't donations. You are right. They are a part of a compulsory purse that is mandated by the EC every day you shoot in one of their programs.

What you do with your life is your business. I hope you decide to shoot again. In the meantime maybe you should find another hobby other than lecturing those that are shooters.

Sorry again you can't shoot for those trophies on the west coast.
 
#106 ·
Joe just keeps on spinning and spinning things to suit his agenda. Can't be a compulsury purse if all participants aren't in the purse, can it. Just change to another name for it I guess.

Why tell Bob that trophy costs pale in comparision to the $100,000? Do ATA expenditures on trophies really pale in comparision to $100,000? Why is the added lewis money different from the trophy costs ATA incurs. With your spin, it would seem they are all the same?
 
#107 ·
870

You politely asked: "Why is the added lewis money different from the trophy costs ATA incurs"

Because a trophy is not a purse.

Close your eyes and think about it. Exhale now. Now rethink...and repeat the saying...trophies are not purses. Purses cannot be mandatory. trophies are not purses. Purses cannot be mandatory.trophies are not purses. Purses cannot be mandatory.trophies are not purses. Purses cannot be mandatory.trophies are not purses. Purses cannot be mandatory.trophies are not purses. Purses cannot be mandatory.

Now open your eyes and read the following:

The ATA has a rule about this:

SECTION VIII
PURSES AND OPTIONS
A. COMPULSORY PURSES No compulsory purse and/or option of any type shall be permitted in any tournament in which ATA trophies or ATA added monies are provided.

It is complicated you may have to repeat.

Best of luck with that.
 
#109 ·
But Joe, you didn't answer my question about trophy costs? Obviously neither trophies nor the added money is a compulsory purse, by definition, so what is the difference? You'll just have to come up with another name.

Oh no, the trophy costs are paid out of the general fund! Plus they go to people at shoots that I won't be at this year.

If I do get a chance to go to the Grand this year, I can shoot for half of that $100,000 without paying any special fee and I don't have to shoot the 900 target lewis.
 
#110 ·
"As you say the mandatory fees that go into the purse aren't donations. You are right. They are a part of a compulsory purse that is mandated by the EC every day you shoot in one of their programs."

Nameless I think you should stand corrected on that I didn't say they a donations you did. They also are not any part of a compulsory purse they in effect part of your entry fee. This rule backs that up or didn't bother to read any further. Or maybe it doesn't fit your purpose.

A. REGISTERED SHOOTS

1. The ATA governs the conduct of all shoots registered with it. Only clubs
affiliated with their State/Provincial Association will be permitted to
hold registered shoots.

2. To constitute a registered shoot the following requirements must
be met:

a. all contestants must be members of ATA at the time of their entry,
and

b. each contestant must pay an ATA daily registration fee of $3.00
for each day of competition at each shooting location ($1.50 fee for
Big 50 events), and such Zone or State Association fees as may be
charged, and

c. at least three (3) or more contestants must compete in and
complete the same event on the same day of competition.

BTW the rule you quoted explains that compulsory purses are not allowed in the ATA it does not define what a compulsory purse is or what makes it compulsory.

For that you need the definition of the word compulsory from the dictionary. One more little point I would like to clear up.

"The biggest reason you can't win the trophies is you dont shoot trap."

That is almost humorous as at least I haven't shot 100 targets in the last year and claim to be participating again. You seem to be a hypocrite or is it a legend in your own mind.

Bob Lawless
 
#111 ·
Roger reread your first paragraph and then clarify what you are saying and I will answer your questions. In the quote that I posted about what you said there is no statement about compulsory purses.

I never said you said anything about compulsory purses. You did however say,

"If all shooters were ellegable to have a chance at the $100,000. then it would be fair to all."

Roger they are all eligible all they need to do is pay the entry fee just like any other lewis class purse you of all people should understand that Roger better than most. I didn't see anything in the press release that said free lewis.

Bob Lawless
 
#112 ·
Nameisjoe


Reading your definition of purses and trophies, wondering if you would tell what do you think about "cash trophies"?

Several clubs where I shoot ATA, have cash trophies, meaning part of the entry fee goes to the payout of cash to the winners of the events.
 
#113 ·
Bob L

I have shot 300 targets since reactivating my membership at the end of the summer. Unfortunately our $700,000 computer system isn't working well. I have never shot a lot of targets in a single year. My records show that. I doubt I will shoot more than 1000 this year. But, I am the one paying for my targets and you aren't paying for any.

I did not post before becoming a member again.

I agree that donation is the wrong word. It is a mandatory fee that goes into the compulsory purse. The dictionary is very clear what compulsory is.

Most shooters in Ohio do not shoot registered until the weather breaks. That is when we hold the shoots.

I hope you get a chance to shoot for those trophies they wont let you have on the west coast.

Sorry you haven't found a hobby better that telling us how to shoot trap.

Enjoy a 5th year not shooting if that is what you want.

Best of luck.
 
#114 ·
A "compulsory purse" is a purse that all participants in that event are forced to enter. By definition, your description is not accurate since the big complaint is that all participants are not entered in the purse. But of course you already know that. Just put a different spin on it.
 
#116 ·
870

The compulsory purse is a "purse" you are forced to pay into. It is the "event" you enter.

The big complaint it that all that have shot ATA targets during the year paid for the purse but not everyone can enter.

Rick,

I have never seen a cash trophy shoot but I think the rule applies when the trophies are sponsored by the ata. Are there trophies supplied by the ATA for those shoots? It doesn't sound like it. Also, is it mandatory/compulsory that you pay into the purse?

I do not need to know the answer.
 
#117 ·
nameless you just said,

"I doubt I will shoot more than 1000 this year. But, I am the one paying for my targets and you aren't paying for any."

Very astute observation did it ever occur to you that that might be one of my reasons for my not shooting??? No of course not, you should be given every consideration. Me I am just a troll right so I get no consideration

Another reason everyone is getting sick of all your BS you told me.

"I did not post before becoming a member again."

Well name less you also said.

"I didn't start posting here until I started shooting again."

Now that isn't the truth either you posted your first post on TS.com one full month before you shot your handicap targets in 2011. My advice to you is if you are going to make a claim at least make the same claim every time. It (being inconsistent) makes you look untruthful and then no one trusts you.

You also said "The dictionary is very clear what compulsory is." Doesn't it tell you in the ATA rule that no Compulsory Purses which means one must play the purse or they are not allowed to enter. At the Grand everyone can shoot all events even those that are included in the 900 targets they just aren't included in the lewis payout. If the events had a compulsory purse no one would shoot unless they played the purse That is compulsory. Not where the money came from or how it was acquired.

Bob Lawless
 
#119 ·
Oh my Bob 30 days....say it isn't so!!! LOL Call the posting police....You are the busybody of the ATA.

Good luck with your 5th year not shooting.

Also, you ask me if I care why you are not shooting. I don't give a rats ass. It's your life. Not everyone sticks their nose up everyones buttocks likes you. Don't shoot if you don't want too or can't. You act like everyone has to explain their life to you and we have have to enjoy our life by your rules.

Isn't that a mega-busybody?

Again it is kind of pathetic that the only hobby you can find is telling others how to participate.

For those that shoot the ATA rule book doesn't define the word compulsory as you say. It also doesn't define the word "the". The dictionary defines the words.

Enjoy not shooting. Here's to a happy busybody lifestyle.
 
#120 ·
Fla and Lyle,

Come the the CC at the end of June. We can work something out. You will be treated well and we don't have much need for name calling.

Fla...

You might want to check on the recent investments of the ATA before you continue tho. There was a thread showing the investments haven't gone real well. I am including the audit as well as failing computer systems and software. Gary can help you with that.

Good luck with the name calling. You won't win many arguments with it.
 
#121 ·
Joe:

Come on now, you know you are just having some fun here. "Compulsory" is an adjective describing the noun "purse". The term is used more often in Skeet, since as you know ATA doesn't have any. If everyone doesn't have to participate in the purse it's not compulsory. I have to pay my $20 or whatever lewis fee it is to be eligible for some of this money, so you have to spin it again.
 
#125 ·
It looks like your on your way out Mr. McPeek. I told you, you would be your own worst enemy. Keep it coming I see that you are now becoming agitated as your name calling has increased and you are flinging personal attacks towards other members.

It won't be long before the BanHammer will fall on you.
 
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