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Annie Oakleys

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by code5coupe, Jul 6, 2007.

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  1. code5coupe

    code5coupe Member

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    In the last two years, I've found that I really come to love the Annies, chips, buddies, etc. that many of the local clubs do on their fun 'n' games days.

    Many of the guys I shoot with/against are handloaders who concoct special loads for the games, loads such as 1.5oz of buffered 5's for the Annies. (We shoot all the games from the 27)
    These guys are so serious that they change loads depending on whether they are the first, or the second, or the third, or the fourth, etc. shooter down the line.

    They make some pretty spectacular shots using these special loads. As a non-reloader, I need some help here. What are some of the commercially-available loads you'd recommend for these extremly long-yardage shots? The Nitro 27/Sporting Clays are all I have at this point.....
     
  2. BLACKDOG

    BLACKDOG TS Member

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    Yes. if go to Federal shells the have a pheasant load 1 1/4 oz of 5 or 6 shot at 1500 fps and Winchester offers a High Vel. load at 1400 fps with 7.5 and 6 shot. All these are safe and you do not have to experiment, they are some what expensive, but alot less work.
     
  3. trapman69

    trapman69 Member

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    Just about all I shoot is annies,protections and meat shoots. Annies from the 27yard! Your shooting all you need 1300fps nitro's 7.5shot will break them all day long regardless of spot in line. The skill is knowing where to shoot. By the third man your going to be aiming 4 foot below the bird unless the guys you shoot with or crazy fast shooters. The loads levi391 suggest are great loads but I use that type of shell if I'm 50+yards behind trap not at the 27. Anyway save your money and practice shooting the birds as they drop next time your out shooting. Good luck to ya. Tom R
     
  4. Ahab

    Ahab Well-Known Member

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    Your loads are only 1/2 of the story! Your shotgun is the other 1/2!

    One time I was in a hurry and forgot to grab my "Annie Loads" when packing up.
    IDID remember to bring along a 3" Mod 12, tho!

    Amazingly, I was picking off 4th and 5th shots from the 50 yard line with 3 dram 7 1/2s. made a bunch of $$ that nite!
     
  5. alfermann66

    alfermann66 Member

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    In the text of the Lyman Third Edition loading manual there is a lot of good information about buffered loads and pressures, etc. The bottom line is that you can buffer any printed load, but must assume a pressure increase of 1500-2500psi. As you can see, it would be wise to start with a load that has a pressure of 9000psi or less. You will find "Nay sayers" on this site about it, but I've been doing it for 20 years without ill-effect on equipment, my person or anyone else. However, shooting from the 27 yd. line buffered loads are not nescessary. A 1 1/4 oz. load of un-buffered sixes at 1300-1350 fps is quite adequate at that range. Additionally, from my experience buffering shot smaller than #5 is a waste of time. If the wind is in your face the buffering will be also, as well as those of your non-appreciative shooting friends.

    Buz
     
  6. Mdl1261

    Mdl1261 Member

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    Hey I.ve been shooting annies for aLOOOOONG time I've learned one thing if your on them yourON them no matter 7.5 6,or 5's just remember if they're too fast
    they'll be holes in your pattern .I shoot a mdL 12 and they get crushed at the 35yrd line store bought nitro,gun club, topgun work just fine .Why kill yourself with recoil if you dont have to...Chuck
     
  7. Jawhawker

    Jawhawker TS Member

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    For the distance your shooting I would look for commercial huntng loads with copper or nickle 7.5's or sixes for 4th and 5th shot. I like the ole live pigeon round which is 1220 fps and 1 1/4 oz. Yes the trap loads will break them, but you'll have to center up on them inorder to allow enough hits on target to break. Reason is, the target is loosing spin/velocity thus increasing difficulty to break apart.

    Also remember, if your playing these games for several hours, let the boys play with their ounce and a half loads!!!! They won't last long and be effective....
     
  8. dfm

    dfm Member

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    Annies in my part of the country are shot during the Fall and Winter months. It gets pretty cold and I've shot a lot of them in the -10's. You need good quality hard shot of adequate size(5's, 6's) and portions (1-1/4oz. is very common) to get the job done once targets get winter hard. Buffering helps immensely but I'm one of a handful that bother to do it. A velocity of 1200-1250fps is all that's necessary even if you end up in the parking lot to break ties. Anything faster starts to ruin the pattern. Those 1500fps Longshot reloads are a joke once you put them on paper.

    Only kids, women, and city folk shoot from the 27 or closer around here.
     
  9. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    I have shot a lot of Annie Oakleys, Protections, etc. and never needed anything hotter than a factory Nitro 27 or AA Silver Bullet ... Handicap, 7 1/2's is all you need if your close enough to see them ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  10. code5coupe

    code5coupe Member

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    Pheasantmaster,
    Interesting that you'd mention the old pigeon loads, as I just ordered a case of the Remington STS Pigeon loads(1 1/4oz #8)....they look like they just might be the perfect load for me for the chip shoots.

    I also have ordered a Briley extra full choke for these games and their tiny targets (chips shoots) or long range birds (Annies, buddies). Anyone have any thoughts on tighter-than-Full chokes???

    By the way, what is "protection" shooting?? Might that be what we call buddy shoots?
    Oh, and when I say we shoot from the 27, I mean we START shooting from the 27....usually the last 3 or 4 guys end up out in the parking lot. And, normally, I'm not among them!

    Thanks for the tips, guys!
     
  11. Old 870

    Old 870 TS Member

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    Man stick with your nitro's. They are more than enough to break a target from 27 yard and beyond. The only other shell I would try from 27 for games are the White Rhino from Fiocci, they also work well. From 50yards I use 1 1\4 oz 6 at 1350fps. Smokes the little orange dot. You need to find the shell that works for you. For me the Nitros work great, but if I shoot the Sporting Clays I can't hit sh*t. For me they just don't work.

    As far as chokes are concerned, don't waste your money on what you think you should use. I have a whole set of thin wall Brileys for my 90T from extra full to big fat and sloppy, and I use my improved modified for everything from 16 all the way back to 50. It works just fine.

    Remember these guys that load all of these fancy loads have probably been shooting a long time, and that has more to do with why they are so good at games than the shells.
     
  12. ricks1

    ricks1 TS Member

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    one thing is find the size shot and type shell YOUR gun shoots best i have a browing A 5 could not break 10 from the 16 with no5 might get 15 with 7.5 and smaller can do very good at 40 yds with no6 so its what the gun likes i have shot rabbits at unreal yardage with no 6 Mark V s
     
  13. code5coupe

    code5coupe Member

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    From: zarathrusta
    Some Annie Oakley shooters are very skilled.
    - but fooling yourself into thinking it's a skill seems delusional to me.

    Now you've got me confused. ?? Whatever it is, I sure don't have it at this time.....


    Attended another round of games at the club last night....I can't believe some of those old boys (and a few of the younger boys...35-40years old?) can break targets out there that are about 5 feet from hitting the ground, and they do it three out of five times. :eek:
    And I'm talking standing 40 yards from the house, ON THE SIDE, so that every bird is a near-90degree hard left or hard right (depending on the game).

    I don't have much problem with normal 27yard targets, but these guys are from a completely different universe than I. :roll eyes:

    By the way, picked up a case of Remington Nitro Pheasant loads after last night: 1 3/8oz of hard buffered #6 for the Annies. Maybe by the time those are gone I'll have learned how to hit 100yards-and-dropping targets. :)
    The consensus out there last night is that you need at least #6's to achieve one-pellet breaks at those distances; #7 1/2's just have the energy.

    I also observed many shot patterns out at 100yds (we shoot across a valley and the slope on the other side is mostly bare, dry dirt...so we can see the dust raised by each pellet. Seeing patterns that are 20feet in diameter and 1-2feet between pellet strikes makes me realize that not only does one have to be very good to break targets at 100yds, but an element of luck comes into play after the skill!

    Thanks for the all the info so far.

    Code
     
  14. cubancigar2000

    cubancigar2000 Well-Known Member

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    I use Fiochi Golden Pheasant nikel plated copper #4's
     
  15. Jawhawker

    Jawhawker TS Member

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    code5, you really need to start reloading and then learn to buffer. Those Rem's are OK but you can develop a better load...

    It takes alot of playing to put together a long distance load if your going to play in the "parking lot".. Alot of paper work! Its amazing how patterns come apart at 60 yards plus.
     
  16. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    We used to shoot a game called 5 for $5 (winner take all) from approx 45 yards behind the trap house ... You would be amazed at how many guy would break all 5 targets from there and have to move back to about 50 yards for a shoot off ... Taking into account the distance to the trap house and the distance a target would fly before being shot at, I'd say it was pushing the shells to the limits ... We had a few guys who loaded their own "Hot Stuff" and they hardly ever made it back beyond the first 5 targets ... I know the one guy destroyed a perfectly good Model 12 from shooting his loads in it ... The guys who shot the factory new shells are the ones who usually won the things except on a rare occasion ... The ground was littered with new AA's and Nitro's when the games were over ... We also shot 2 man protections ($5 each) from back there and if you doubled on your partner it was a lost target ... The key was to get on them and shoot fast and he or they who hesitated usually lost ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  17. Twinbirds

    Twinbirds TS Member

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    If you can't use the same type shells , don't play. It is very simple. Everyone that uses heavy shells are shooting some type of recoils oftened gun and it don't make much difference to them on recoil.They are able to stay in the gun through the recoil. Sure you can break them all the way to the ground with regular traploads,but you have to be more centered on your target to do it as consistently as the heavier shells. Energy breaks targets, but it still has to be put on the target. If all shooters of equal skill and equipment were shooting and all but 1 had regular shells the guy with the heavier shell has the edge. I have shot in places where the ground drops away and targets could be in the air for another 25 or 30 yards.
     
  18. trapman69

    trapman69 Member

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    zarathrusta (What in the heck kind of login name is this)
    I think model 12 man has won. You apparently do have a high
    opinion of yourself. You just insulted and belittled someone.
    Your words.
    {The interesting part is that the skilled Annie Shooters (at my club) are pretty nice guys. Most of the others are buffoons. The whole thing is kinda funny.}
    Read your post again and maby you will see like I did what an ASS YOU ARE.
    Please tell us what club your from so we can stay the hell away from there.
    Don't look me up, while I admire the Heck out of guys that can shoot 24's consistantly you won't see me amongst them In your big fancy name page. I find the whole thing boring. I'll stick with the annie crowd.
    Best regards and you can have the opinion for free.
    P.S I must be delusional because I would love to shoot some annies with you and have you expain why I keep taking your money.
     
  19. trapman69

    trapman69 Member

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    Ok last post on this subject not feeling as tempermental as earlier.
    Again your words(What I said was, "I never criticized, etc. a shooter for their ability." I have not.
    He won his yardage on a New Year's Day shoot. Not bad. What was the yardage? We have no way to prove it but I'll bet it was short. How many squads on that January day? How many A and AA shooters were there? How many weren't hung-over as all get-out? Did he stop shooting registered because of the money involved or did he go home too many times with his tail between his legs and making excuses? My money's on the bruised tail.

    I'd say that's criticizing a shooter for their ability or at the very least insulting the shooter by stating It was short yardage or that he has a bruised tail. Admit it that high priced College didn't teach you reading comprehension.
    By stating that the good annie shooters were Interestingly pretty nice fella's. And the others were mostly buffoon's, your insinuating if your not a good shot your more than likely a buffoon.
    So how much does it cost these buffoons to be in this Private Club?
    You are correct on one thing I am a decent person. Probably has to do with the fact that I am a pretty good shot. Anyway that was some fun have to get to bed early so I can go sling some golden BB's tommorrow.
     
  20. W.P.T.

    W.P.T. TS Member

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    I used to like to shoot the Annie Oakleys and pick your partner Protections because most of the shooters who had the most and greatest knowledge of shooting long yardage was the 20-21 yard shooters ... They would go to a registered shoot and shoot terribly from their assigned yardage and then shoot the Annies and Protections the same way and tell the guys who won what they were doing wrong ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
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