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AA hulls. What's the difference

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by Barrelbulge(Fl), May 4, 2008.

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  1. Barrelbulge(Fl)

    Barrelbulge(Fl) Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    Is there any visable difference in the old AA's and the new AA's. I have about 2500 AA's from about 5 years ago that I never loaded and I have 6 flats of AA's that I have not shot at least 3 of the flats are a few years old. Do they load the same? What is the difference? Your input would be appreciated.Thanks, Mike
     
  2. Texas Ton

    Texas Ton TS Member

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    At first glance the HS hulls are glossy, the CF AA's have a dull appearance. Look inside and see a separate basewad on the HS's, if you can't see the difference. You can also just dig into a pile of them and pick out either, feel the difference.

    They use the same data but don't load the same, now if you're dropping enough powder to hold off the wad from the basewad, no difference. You can run into circumstances where the wad can hang on the basewad, especially if using straight walled wads in the tapered case. This was once an accepted practice, be careful with the HS hull in doing this.

    There are some wads considered straight walled, that will work, most won't.
     
  3. Barrelbulge(Fl)

    Barrelbulge(Fl) Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    Texas, Thanks for responding. I use CB 1112's ( the pink claybusters). Is this a problem
     
  4. ColBuckShot

    ColBuckShot TS Member

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    Which wads are straight walled and which are not. Which goes with what hulls, please define.
     
  5. Texas Ton

    Texas Ton TS Member

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    If you mean the 1100-12's, not a problem.

    All wad manufacturers designate which wad is for which case. Like a 12S3/SO/S4/C1 or any Federal wads will be for StraightWalled cases, Fiocchi/Gualandi/UEE-RIO/BP(Baschierri-Pellagri)/Cheddite and several others are straight walled. If made for a AA or Rem hull, they are tapered.

    I guess the only exception I can think of off hand, Windjammers are said to be used in either. I've used the 1 oz WJ's with success in the HS hull.
     
  6. chatbrat

    chatbrat TS Member

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    I for one will not reload the new AA--I saw a base wad separate & lodge in a Rem 1100--it was pure luck---the shooter said the round did not sound right & he knocked the base wad out with his knocker outer rod----that was enough for me----there are tons of good hulls at all clubs for free these days---Rem. gun clubs, game clubs,sport clubs STS & Nitros since fewer & fewer people are reloading these days---if I didn't have close to a ton of shot I doubt I would be reloading-----Phil
     
  7. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    I, for one, only reload AA hulls. Not because I think they are the best, but just because I have so many of them. I have seen a few well used hulls with the base wad loose. All of these were the first group of new style hulls made before Winchester made a change in the way the base wad was attached to the rest of the hull. With the powder charge in front of the base wad, I have difficulty figuring out how the base wad can get into a barrel even if it became loose.

    I continue to reload because I can still produce a box of shells a little less expensive than new discount shells. I also believe, with just limited evidence, that I can produce a better quality shell with my reloads than I can purchase at discount prices. I will also shoot 30-40 flats of new AA shells this year. I have about 60 flats now and they take up too much room.

    Pat Ireland
     
  8. BT-99MAX

    BT-99MAX Member

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    Pat: I have noticed that the new style AA's, (glossy), come in two slightly different appearances. The early ones had a square around the AA insignia on the side of the hull, while the later manufactured ones do not have this square. Do you think this might be Winchester's way of identifying the change made in the base wad configuration?
     
  9. JerryP

    JerryP Active Member

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    Pat, what was this "change in the way the base wad was attached to the rest of the hull" that Winchester performed?
     
  10. BDodd

    BDodd TS Member

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    The original AA hull was one piece; the base wad simply part of the entire hull and the interior of the hull was smoothly tapered to form that base wad. The newer hull - known as the HS hull - is of two piece construction; essentially a tube with no taper at the base and then the second piece being the base wad that, when installed in the base of the tube, forms a tapered base resembling the original. But, the HS IS NOT the same as the originals since adding the 2nd piece it forms, however slight, a shoulder at the top of the base wad. Early loadings with the HS hull found people forcing wads that always worked in the original AA hulls to catch on that shoulder and either cock the wad or prevent it from sealing the powder below it. In later months or years, Winchester made modifications to their wads so that they slipped into the new HS hull and past the wad shoulder much more reliably and I can only guess that CB and others did the same. However, with our propensity, as loaders, to use most any wad in and hull there are still times the AA HS hull will not make a reliable reload with Federal wads and those from Europe. I mean no insult by trying to cover the basic details of this dilemma though I find it hard to believe there are those that still haven't heard of this situation. I HAVE seen loose base wads in the HS hulls and I've seen photos of alleged base-wads-migrating-into-the-barrel but, like Pat, can't seem to understand that part. Secret fix? Use new Winchester wads in your AA hulls.....breakemall....Bob Dodd
     
  11. JerryP

    JerryP Active Member

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    BDodd, I've seen a few gray AA's with HS stamped on the brass. I've bought thousands of 2 piece AA'a that don't have HS stamped on the brass. What's the story on that.

    I have used the 2 piece hull since they came out and I have never had a wad catch on the insert as you mention. Are you sure a change was made to the wads? Have you actually measured a difference?
     
  12. Barrelbulge(Fl)

    Barrelbulge(Fl) Banned User Banned TS Supporters

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    From the posts I received here i gather that the cb1100-12 will work in either hull new or old. Or am I reading this wrong. Thanks everyone, Mike.
     
  13. BDodd

    BDodd TS Member

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    JerryP, I don't have a clue if they're stamped or not with the HS you describe cuz I immediately began to use nothing but Remingtons after problems were reported. I look in the hull to see if it's a one piece tapered hull or a two piece hull to determine one or the other for folks but, again, I just don't bother with the hull anymore. Am I sure Winchester actually made a change in the wad? Yes, I've never considered measuring but unless I'm terribly mistaken (again) the wad bag is so marked and others here could describe what change was made.

    mengwe, I "believe" CB made a change in their wads also but, again, I have no experience or personal knowledge with anything to do with AAs after the problem surfaced.

    BTW, I didn't mean to imply that early loading with the HS hull ALWAYS caused problems with wad insertion but it was often enough to cause concerns with cocked wads, crushing of hulls, bloopers, and alleged base wads out of place after firing. I know MEC posted suggestions on how to adjust their machines to help solve the problem and I know that wad makers, at least Winchester, made a change in their wads. What's most amazing to me is how Winchester took a hull that pretty much was the standard for all clay shooters and made a change that made them well below the new #1 hull. I seem to remember there were long lines for Remington shells at the next year's Grand and very little business at the Winchester house....breakemall....Bob Dodd
     
  14. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    BT-99MAX- I have noticed a couple of changes in the style of printing on AA hulls. I do not know what they indicate. Also, the new AA shells now come in a cardboard flat that is white with black and red printing. The black flats with white and red printing have been replaced.

    JerryP- I do not know what Winchester did to secure the migrating base wad problem. They did make a change and the problem has now apparently disappeared. If Winchester would reveal the change, it would be an admission of an earlier mistake and this could have some liability ramifications.

    Pat Ireland
     
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