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A question for ATA officials

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by phirel, Aug 22, 2007.

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  1. phirel

    phirel TS Member

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    There are many students shooting and working for us at the Grand. October would eliminate them. Many shooters also are active in bird hunting in October. There are two Satellite Grands, Middletown Handicap and the MO Handicap shoot that might have to be rescheduled if the Grand were in Oct.

    Summer is the traditional vacation for many families and, at least psychologically, Summer ends Sept. 1.

    Pat Ireland
     
  2. BIGDON

    BIGDON Well-Known Member

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    Pat; Don't confuse the issue with logic. The numbers of temeporary help that you need are made up primarily of students, high school and college. It caused a slight problem this year when some of the schools started in Ill. the 2nd week.

    You would have to make major scheduling changes because everything now is geared to August. I think your SCPT program would disappear.

    Don
     
  3. Steve-CT

    Steve-CT TS Member

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    I agree. The trap help are primarily students off for the summer and many of the shooters' families have school age kids. So, pushing the Grand ahead to September is not an option.

    The earlier summer months are filled with regularly scheduled state and zone championships and most registered shoots are held from late April through
    August. The second and third weeks of August is the only practical time frame that exists to accommodate all these factors.
     
  4. skeet_man

    skeet_man Well-Known Member

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    or have a "Junior Grand" similar to the Junior World they have for skeet
     
  5. trpshtr35

    trpshtr35 TS Member

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    Good idea Jerry but they wont change. I hope NEIL will listen. Change is good for every thing. Sure glad they dont make cars like they used to do. Why do think the scores are better now, it is because the you need to put out a better product. Hell I shot in the days of card wads and horse hair took a lot of work to get the lead out your barrel,now they worry about plastic buld up.But I think Neil is the best thing that has come along since cheese. in Wi.And I shot A Mdl 12 for years how many shoot them now. Think about it
     
  6. slide action

    slide action Well-Known Member

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    I have wondered also. The school year used to be a consideration, as most schools didn't start until late Aug. While there are SOME schools who still start after the second week in Aug., I think you will find the majority of the country has moved up their class dates and have started their classes by the second week in Aug.now. This year had record temp. Not saying it will happen, but perhaps considered.
     
  7. GoldEx

    GoldEx Active Member

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    Wow. Talk about thinking outside the box! Swapping the GLG with the Grand sounds like a super idea. Cooler average temps than August. Potentially a better turnout for the GLG as well with the threat of dryer weather. Do the schools in Sparta let out by the end of May or do they go into June? My kids don't start until the day after Labor Day starting this year. There will be a lot of squawking about any date change and how it will impact this state shoot or that zone shoot etc... One year will have that all ironed out and it will be back to business as usual.

    Jeff
     
  8. spitter

    spitter Well-Known Member TS Supporters

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    While I would not try to imagine the logistics in moving around tournaments, I wonder whether the "kids" issue is more of knee-jerk reaction.

    I have heard there are towns in southern Illinois who actually let kids out for intermittent periods for hunting seasons. I would have to imagine that for up to 10 days out of a school year the local school districts might have some sort of cooperative education where juniors and seniors would get coop work credit and time out of school to go to a job - especially for a short time gig as big as the Grand is to the Sparta area.

    Secondly, how many shooting folks actually traveled with their school aged kids. Not having any children myself - how big a deal is it to pull your smaller kids out of school for up to 10 days or leave the non-shooting mom/dad at home?

    Not trying to start something, but if this year's heat turns out to not be an aberation, options have to be considered for shooters' health.

    Jay Spitz
     
  9. GoldEx

    GoldEx Active Member

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    Jeff (Alf174)-

    What pray tell kind of business would a PLC guy like you be doing in Sparta that did not involve trapshooting?

    Jeff
     
  10. Barry

    Barry Member

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    What a great idea Jerry B. has! I realize the main reason for the Grand in August is tradition, but if it's a bad idea (as it sure is) let's change it!

    Over the Memorial day week/end I'd make the trip from California, I won't do it in hot sweaty August! I consider August in the mid-west to be the absolutely worst and most uncomfortable time for the Grand anyone could possibly choose. & that's coming from a guy that grew up in Michigan and went to Vandalia 12 times.

    It's probably way too good of an idea to ever become reality, but it sure would increase Grand attendance by leaps and bounds!

    Barry
     
  11. bcnu

    bcnu Active Member

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    Jay, I don't know about anywhere else, but the school that my daughter goes to has a limit of something like 8 days that you can be absent before you lose your credits for the year and have to re do it. John
     
  12. nomderf

    nomderf TS Member

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    Nobody could predict the type of weather they experienced at the Grand. One big factor is trap help. Who really wants to burn up in that type of heat for the $$ they are paying?

    I didn't feel a bit bad about not attending after looking at the weather forecast! My 84 year old shooting buddy would have never been able to shoot in weather like that.

    Have it when it possibly could be cooler and you just about have to hold it when the kids are out of school.

    Already planning to attend in 2008!

    38-01615
     
  13. JBrooks

    JBrooks TS Member

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    Now that the shoot year has been moved to Nov. 1st, having the Grand in October makes even more sense. The "kids" issue is totally bogus. The kids don't shoot registered targets. 90%+ of them went home. If the kids want to shoot in August, let them.

    There are far more guys with school age kids who can't attend the Grand in August because they are taking family vacations to places families want to go. "Hey kids, do you want to go to Sparta so I can shoot trap or do you want to go to Disney World?" Duh.

    As for trap help, if it is so feakin hot that 50 of your kids realize that they ain't paying me enough to work in 100+ weather and don't show up, it really is trading one problem for another. Further, if the whole Grand is dependent on hiring school age kids to work it, that seems a problem all on its own.

    You can bet that a lot of guys will be watching the weather forecast next year and if it even approaches this years temps, they won't go.
     
  14. JEB

    JEB Active Member

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    Westy Hogans in Elysburg is a pretty well run shoot. It takes place in early Sept after the kids have gone back to school. I know the last few years there has been help problems, no kids, and a lot of shooters had to pitch in. I think a late Grand would be a fiasco. Thank God there was a lot of help this year.

    John Bergman
     
  15. calilori

    calilori TS Member

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    Our schools here started August 13, and as a teacher I go back the week before, so for me I will never be able to attend the Grand, nor will any of the students in my area. However, schedules are different all over the country and I guess you just can't please everybody all the time, so what's convenient for one will be inconvenient for somebody else.
     
  16. Dave90T

    Dave90T TS Member

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    JBrooks said:
    "The "kids" issue is totally bogus. The kids don't shoot registered targets. 90%+ of them went home."

    I'm not too sure about that... I saw plenty of colleagues over the two weeks that are in the Junior and Sub-Junior category. I shot all but 3 events in Preliminary week and all events during Grand week - singles, handicap, doubles - and there were always plenty of Juniors and Sub-Juniors out there posting scores. I agree that most of the STCP shooters went home, but you can't discount the many independent shooters like myself that compete. Junior and Sub-Junior shooters are the future of this sport, and making it more difficult for them to shoot - especially an event such as the Grand American - could have a negative effect on the future of the ATA.
     
  17. Unsingle

    Unsingle Member

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    Forget the kids for trap help, just use illegals. Think of all the money we could save.
     
  18. FPBristol

    FPBristol TS Member

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    Perhaps we should start thinking about how we can move the Grand to a more comfortable time of the year instead of how we cannot. If nothing else have the Grand in May. Not nearly as hot and most older kids are out of school before the 1st of June. Changing the target year is simply an administrative function of the BOD. I know we can think of many reasons to not change, but the aging of our participants would be better served by more moderate conditions, and the idea has merit.
     
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