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870 vs 1100 Recoil

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by Darth Vader, Mar 1, 2008.

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  1. Darth Vader

    Darth Vader TS Member

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    Would an 870 weighing two pounds more than an identical 1100 have about the same amount of recoil? Thank you for the information! James Carpenter
     
  2. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Nope, the 1100 will still recoil less. You're going to need a lot more weight then two lbs. Keep in mind that the 1100 weighs at least a pound more then the 870 in the first place.
     
  3. Onceabum

    Onceabum TS Member

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    No Way, James. I once had those same guns set up about like you describe. The recoil on the 1100 was still much less.

    Booger
     
  4. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    There will be a point where the 870 will have the same felt recoil as the 1100, but I'll bet you'll have to add several pounds of weight. <br>
    <br>
    For the 870, you're trying to reduce a sharp recoil peak by adding more mass. It's going to take a lot of added mass to accomplish that.<br>
    <br>
    The 1100 uses different physics to reduce the recoil. It reduces the sharp recoil peak by converting the recoil energy into stored energy, then a moment later converts this stored energy back into recoil energy. If you graphed this, instead of a single peak like a mountain, you'd have two low hills. The first is the sharp peak reduced to a hill, and the second is a smaller hill where the stored energy is added back.<br>
    <br>
    If you checked the area that was reduced from a sharp peak to a low hill, and compared it to the second hill, you'd find they were the same. The gas automatic simply reduced the felt recoil by making it less of a peak but essentially making it have a longer duration. This is why a gas auto is said to give a push instead of a sharp rap.<br>
    <br>
    That's why it's going to take a lot of mass to reduce the recoil of the 870. The 870 cannot convert the recoil impulse by storing energy and releasing it. It can only absorb it by sheer mass. I've fired 870's with a lot of extra weight, and they feel nothing like an 1100.
     
  5. School Teacher

    School Teacher Well-Known Member

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    The 1100 and 11/87 have a wonderful recoil dissipating action. The recoil pulse is felt over an extended period of time and some of the recoil force and gas is used to operate the action.


    Last week, I shot an older 11/87 sporting clays gun that, with its 28” barrel and trimmer stock, is about 1 ½ pounds lighter than my 870 trap with the 30” step rib barrel and 6 oz. recoil reducer. I was using identical 1200 fps 1 oz loads in each shotgun.


    The 870 had light recoil and the 11/87 had almost no recoil. For further analysis, I shot a few 3 dram 8’s in the 11/87 sporting clays and it still had less recoil than the heavier 870 with 1 oz loads.


    For light recoil, IMO, the 1100 or 11/87 is the way to go.


    Ed Ward
     
  6. Colonel Reb

    Colonel Reb TS Member

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    I have both the 870 and the 1100 trap models. First of all, I can't tell any difference in the recoil, but I must have the best 870 trap ever constructed for all the talk here, and I agree that the 1100 in theory has less recoil, but "felt" recoil is in the shoulder of the individual shooter and will differ for everyone. Personally I don't feel it. What I do notice, though, is that I shoot the 870 better. I have been wondering why and have shot lots of rounds with the 1100 trying to equal how well I shoot the 870 to no avail. Now that you guys are mentioning the pretty significant weight difference, that could be why I shoot differently, in this case better, with the 870.

    The 1100 is often described as an automatic 870, but to me it really has a different feel to it.
     
  7. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    I started trap with an 870. I could only shoot two rounds comfortably, and three at the most. My 1187 allows me to literally shoot all day.
     
  8. ec90t

    ec90t Guest

    The closer comparison would be between an 870 Comp and a 1100. My 870 Comp is a bit softer shooting (for me) than any 1100. Though, I find a 1100 quite comfortable to shoot.

    ec90t
     
  9. AveragEd

    AveragEd Well-Known Member

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    I have an 870TC with a Dead Mule attached to the magazine tube cap and an 1100TT with no recoil reducing additions. While my 870 doesn't "kick hard," it does give me more of a "punch" while the 1100's felt recoil is more of a "push."

    One way to soften the feel of an 870's recoil is use one of the older "Target" barrels with a .745" bore. I'm not sure exactly why, but several 870 owners complaining of high felt recoil from their guns have tried my barrel and couldn't believe they were shooting the same gun.

    Ed
     
  10. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    And yet, ec90t, I can't tell any recoil help with either of my 870 comps. They are both killers on both ends. In contrast, when I occasionally left the pistion out of my 303, I could tell in one shot.

    Brian, are you sure there really is that first peak you refer to? There may be, in fact some of my tests show it, but others don't. Otherwise I think your description is pretty accurate, though a bit of a simplification. The lesser recoil might be better thought of in terms of the speed of the various masses of the 1100 rather than just storing the energy in a spring, though that also happens just as you say.

    Think of it this way. Lock the bolt back, shoulder the gun, release the bolt. Estimate the recoil. That's all the spring can account for, and it's not much.

    Neil
     
  11. ec90t

    ec90t Guest

    Neil,

    Maybe I just have an abnormally soft shooting one. The funny thing about it is the stock really doesn't fit me that well. I have to work to get it into my shoulder. When I get my new stock done (1/4" cast-off 3/8" toe out), I can't wait to see how soft it is then.

    Mind you, I shoot games with this thing!

    ec90t
     
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