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7/8 oz Clay's powder usage?

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by new loader, Jul 26, 2009.

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  1. new loader

    new loader Member

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    7/8 oz Clay

    Hodgon shows 18.3 gr (minimum listing) Clays for 7/8 oz load. This is more powder than I use for 1-1/8 shell. I am looking for soft shooting shell, not speed. Anybody use less with satisfactory results? Using Winchester hulls, Winchester primers, WAA12L wads. Can use other primers if necessary. Shows powder loads of 18.3, 19.2, 20.5.
     
  2. Carol Lister

    Carol Lister TS Member

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    You will use less powder with a 1 1/8 oz. load because it's harder to get 1 1/8 oz. of shot moving than it is 7/8 oz. This gives the powder charge time to build more pressure under the 1 1/8 oz. load that you don't get with the 7/8 oz. load. Use too much of the wrong powder under a 1 1/8 oz. load trying to get velocity and you will over-pressure the gun's chamber. Clays is not a powder for heavy, high-speed loads.

    You need that much powder with those 7/8 oz. components to develop enough pressure for an efficient burn with the lighter payload, and even with 18.3 grains of powder you're only getting 8300 PSI pressure and 1250 FPS. I don't load anything less than 9000 PSI just so the burns and velocities are consistent. You would need to go up to over 19 grains of powder to get to that point.

    Felt recoil is partly a function of how much weight you're trying to move and partly a function of how fast you're trying to do it. Try the lightest load data. I think you'll be surprised. Or, get yourself some WAA12SL wads and go down to 17 grains of powder and 1200 FPS. That should have virtually no felt recoil at all.

    Carol Lister
     
  3. jimrich60

    jimrich60 Member

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    While I have not checked the loadings using WW hulls, I do load RXP hulls, Downrange 7/8 (pink) wads, Winchester 209 primer and 17.1 grains Hogdons Clays, for a nominal velocity of 1200 fps. Works great in my Beretta unsingle, very soft shooting load, and as long as I do my part, breaks clays with excellent authority. Patterning shows nice even dispersion (within normal limits of light loads) and makes a great 16 yard load for me. I move up to 17.5 grains of Clays and 1 ounce loads using green duster wads (again, nominal 1200 fps) for handicaps, and this also seems to be a very good load, at least in my guns.

    Jim R
     
  4. psfive

    psfive Member

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    Where did you get your Clays? I have been trying to buy some for months and months. Anyway 18.2 grains in a 7/8 oz load and 18.6 in a 1 oz load. Nobel Sport primers, Downrange wads and shot of your choice. Use 7/8 oz for 16's and back to the 20, 1 oz for everything else. He shoots 24's and 25's from everywhere. Paul
     
  5. yellowjacket

    yellowjacket TS Member

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    My load with clays powder which I have used for several thousand rounds is 16.2 or 16.7 , with WAA12LR wad. This is a very comfortable load and will also function in my Rem. 1100 auto loader when I use it. I use this in both Rem. and Win. hulls. Jim.
     
  6. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    I experimented with Clays with 16.8 grains of powder, Remington hulls, Winchester primers, a Federal 12S0 wad, and 7/8 ounces of shot.

    Very mild recoil, and very good breaks.

    If I were to decide I wanted to use 7/8 ounce loads, that's what I'd go with.
     
  7. Cush

    Cush TS Member

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    I've shot many thousands of 7/8 loads with less than 16 gr. of Clays (many at only 14.0 gr.) and never had a problem so long as I made sure wad pressure was adequate. Below 15 gr. is a bit of a dirty burn but, which means more frequent cleaning. 15.5 is very nice.
     
  8. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    "Below 15 gr. is a bit of a dirty burn"

    Which means you're not generating enough pressure to get good, consistent combustion, which also means you muzzle velocities shell-to-shell are probably not very consistent.

    Better to use a little more powder.
     
  9. BDodd

    BDodd TS Member

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    new loader, a quick check of the manual shows that it's only the Winchester and Federal primers that are limiting you to more speed than you want - why not change wads or, better yet, primers and get what you want?.....Bob Dodd

    Additional: I can only guess that Hodgdon didn't test the specific combo you suggest at the 1200 fps velocity or tests were questionable in some manner - why not call Hodgdon and they'll happily give you a solid answer.....BD
     
  10. nsrailroad

    nsrailroad Member

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    Does your score change much from 1oz down to 7/8 ounce. I went from 1 1/8 to 1 ounce haven't seen much difference in my scores.
    Railroad
     
  11. Cush

    Cush TS Member

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    All else being equally, your score will drop when you go from 1 oz. down to 7/8 oz. It is purely a matter of probability analysis.

    The problem is that "all else" is very seldom equal. If you are recoil-sensitive, your scores may go up as you drop to 7/8 oz. For example, most people's shooting ability is constantly changing, so that their scores may be fluctuating for reasons that have nothing to do with how many pellets are in their pattern.

    "Which means you're not generating enough pressure to get good, consistent combustion, which also means you muzzle velocities shell-to-shell are probably not very consistent."

    No, they are consistent, so long as you adjust (increase the powder a bit) as the temp. drops. It is not something I would recommend for everyone, but my point was that you can shoot Clays at lower recipe amounts than are in the Hodgdon manual and make them work fine, if you pay attention to detail.
     
  12. spitter

    spitter Well-Known Member TS Supporters

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    I drop 15.6 gr for my 3/4 oz steel load (9/8oz volume/lead) Cleaning burning and little felt recoil, using a WAA12/clone and Winchester 209 primer into an STS case, generating 6500psi. If I want a little extra "oomph" I can throw another grain.

    regards to all,

    Jay
     
  13. RunGunIPSC

    RunGunIPSC TS Member

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    I use the exact componants you use except I use 16.3 of Clays. I have patterned(40 yards)this load in many guns. I get great patterns with very even distribution of the pellets. I use 8 1/2 size shot. 8 or 9 is fine also. I have chrono'ed this load in a multitude of guns. I get from 1180 to 1200 fps. I have never had a problem with bloopers or weak shells. I normally do not shoot when the temp is below 40 so cannot speak to cold weather performance. In 46 years of loading shotgun,the one universal thing is that too much powder is loaded. Time after time chrono results show this to be true. As to the need for pressure build-up,just crimp deeper. This will allow that to happen. Tom Lobonc,Hamilton,MT
     
  14. new loader

    new loader Member

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    Thanks for all the good info. The question has been satisfactorily answered.
     
  15. Carol Lister

    Carol Lister TS Member

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    <blockquote>"... In 46 years of loading shotgun,the one universal thing is that too much powder is loaded.... As to the need for pressure build-up,just crimp deeper. This will allow that to happen."</blockquote>

    Just curious...

    Have you ever had your by-guess-or-by-golly, seat-of-the-pants crimp depths tested for peak pressure? At least with the recommended powder charge and the default crimp depth of .050" you have a reasonable idea of the pressures you're creating. "Advice" like this is just scary!

    Carol Lister
     
  16. Quack Shot

    Quack Shot Active Member

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    Changing to the CCI 209M primer can help a bit by allowing less powder to be used. Notice the "M" in the primer designation. I use 16.0 grains with either the WAA12L or 12SO wads. The 12S0 or Claybuster clone does a great job and the load is consistent and has "passed" my cold weather simulation testing. I get just a bit over 1200 fps with either wad, but the 12S0 is a bit more consistent in velocity. The Federal 209A worked alright with the 12S0 and 16.0 grains of Clays. These loads were used with the new style Winchester AA hulls.
     
  17. Border Bandit

    Border Bandit Well-Known Member

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    My personal observation is that Aliant's aggressive marketing will cause Clays difficult to find as the supply dries up. Clay Dot is in direct competition for ~$20 less an #8 lb jug, and in good supply. When I ran out of Hodgen Clays it's what I bought, and am on my third jug with good results. + they gave me a cool hat.

    To add to your data, I'm using 16gr of Clay Dot in Nitro Gold hulls/Rem 209 primers with Ballistic Products' Lightning Wads & 7/8oz of #8's for the first doubles target, and am very pleased with the results.

    Some have suggested avoiding the new Winchester AA hulls with these wads. Good luck,......mike
     
  18. skeeljc

    skeeljc Supporting Vendor Supporting Vendor

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    17.2 grs works well in my 7/8 ounce load. 16.5 grs. works for my 3/4 ounce load.

    JIm Skeel
     
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