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45 ACP Reloading Question

Discussion in 'Shooting Related Threads' started by primed, Jan 8, 2011.

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  1. primed

    primed Well-Known Member

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    I have never reloaded metallic. Just bought a reloader on this site and am collecting 45ACP brass. Just bought some ammo at Cabelas. It's marked Herters Select Grade Brass Case. When I opened the package, the size of the primer is very noticably smaller than in my Winchester 45ACP brass. I was expecting that all 45 ACP brass to all take the same primer. Is this common? Is one a small pistol primer and one a large pistol primer or is it something completely strange? The headstamp reads "Fiocchi USA 45A.C.P." The price was right but if I can't reload it, it is far less attractive. Fiocchi on the left and Winchester on the right in above photo.

    I've loaded hundreds of thousands of shotshells but no metallic so any advice is welcome.

    Thank you.

    Bob
     
  2. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    The industry is slowly changing to small pistol primers for the 45 Auto. As a commercial loader, it is giving me nightmares, simply because I must sort range brass by primer size.

    Actually, there are advantages to a small primer in the 45. As long as you sort them, no problem.

    BTW, many of these hulls use crimped primer pockets, like military brass. Again, just one more little step to load.

    I use a Dillon 1050, which decrimps primer pockets.
     
  3. primed

    primed Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Coach

    What is the extra step needed for a crimped primer pocket? If I sound like a rookie it's because I am. I will be using a Dillon 550.

    Thanks again

    Bob
     
  4. BDodd

    BDodd TS Member

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    primed; Dillon makes a device you can use on crimped primer/military brass. It means you must go through a process of removing the crimped primer while at the same time the device re-shapes the primer pocket eliminating the crimps. Once you've processed the subject brass, you won't have to deal with that process again but It's an annoying additional step and can best be solved by not buying a bucket of the military brass. My experience was with a Dillon 550B loader and it DID NOT automatically de-crimp the primer pockets like Sir Coach describes.......breakemall.....Bob Dodd

    BTW, Know that your loader is guaranteed for life at Dillon and it doesn't matter that you aren't the original owner. To ask about their small device for de-crimping primer pockets, call them - Dillon Precision Products, Inc., 8009 E. Dillon’s Way, Scottsdale, Az. 85260-9865.
    1.800.762-3845 fax 602.998-2766. Once you are on their owner list, you'll be getting a monthly breakdown of all their products with some remarkable front pages to view......BD
     
  5. Mapper

    Mapper Member

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    Good Lord!! What's next? Bourbon in paper cartons like milk?
     
  6. GBatch_25

    GBatch_25 Active Member

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    I don't buy Herter's ammo anymore. I bought some 9mm Herter's at Cabela's (price was right) and it did nothing but jam. Even had some misfires. Steel casings as well, or were they aluminum. Anyway, Herter's and I are NOT friendly anymore. And I thought a Glock would feed anything.

    Gene Batchelar
    Wheaton, IL
     
  7. Quack Shot

    Quack Shot Active Member

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    The 45 ACP round is now made with both large and small boxer primers. It is also made in some versions with Berdan primers. The boxer primed cases are the ones you are familiar with.

    RCBS makes a primer pocket swager combo tool that will remove the crimp. You can buy several versions. The link below is the one for both sizes. It might work in a Dillon 550B, but I use it on a Rockchucker. It goes in place of the shell holder and there are versions for small and large primers. It's WAY less expensive than the Dillon tool. See the Video at the above link.

    <a href="http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=en&safe=off&q=rcbs+primer+pocket+swager+combo&wrapid=tljp1294562089803022&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=15373855118219299983&ei=NnMpTdvhOsWblgfvuIGVAg&sa=X&oi=product_catalog_result&ct=result&resnum=3&sqi=2&ved=0CCYQ8wIwAg#" target="_blank">RCBS 9495 Primer Pocket Swager Combo</a>
     
  8. stokinpls

    stokinpls Well-Known Member

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    Hopefully you haven't bought much of the Herter's "stuff". Shoot it and let it lay and save yourself a lot of aggravation. There is absolutely tons of large pistol primered .45 ACP brass out there for you, so chalk this up as a learning session. There really isn't any reason to pick up crimped surplus brass either. You can find all of the commercial .45 ACP brass you could ever want at just a penny or two more than this garbage. Take it easy on yourself. The 550B, as wonderful as it is, will command your full attention at times, so keep it simple and get some good commercial brass and be done with it.

    You have shotshell loading experience, so it's likely you've run into the AA/STS debate and know the answer to that one. This situation is similar. Good luck.
     
  9. higun

    higun Member

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    What is the advantage of the smaller primer?
     
  10. stokinpls

    stokinpls Well-Known Member

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    Likely the bean counters have discovered a cost savings.
     
  11. Jerry944t

    Jerry944t Well-Known Member

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    Typically you'll find 45 brass with small primers marked "NT" which stands for non toxic and was designed for indoor ranges.

    There are vast stores of name brand brass to be had which have the traditional large pistol primers.

    Once you set up your reloader to produce 45 rounds you'll have to make a decision as to whether you want to use the large or small primer accessories.

    Save yourself a bunch of problem and purchase some once fired brass with large primers. I don't even consider reloading the brass with small primers. Keep it simple.
     
  12. Clay KillR

    Clay KillR TS Member

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    It appears that those primers in your picture are the same size, an optical illusion with the dimple in the brass primer vs. a shiny clean silver primer. Look at the distance from the edge of the case to the primer pocket. I shoot thousands of rounds of .45ACP, pick a lot of brass and have yet to come across a shell that uses a small pistol primer.
     
  13. vpr80

    vpr80 Active Member

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    Ok well that's new to me. Been reloading 45acp for a decade and never saw anything about small primers. While this does suck a bit to get new brass and such, it does make it more convenient for me by not having to change out the primer assembly on my XL650 between 38 and 45. Just another thing to watch out for now.
     
  14. primed

    primed Well-Known Member

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    Gene

    There were four factors that lead to this purchase. Price at 13.00 per box, brass case, made in USA and Fiocchi USA on the headstamp. I have never had any issues with Fiocchi ammo in any caliber prior but have never owned a 45 ACP until I bought one on this site a few weeks ago so this is all very new to me. I never buy steel or aluminum cased ammo.

    Quack Shot

    These are boxer primed

    Trapshooters.com

    Source for recent reloader purchase, source of first 1911, source of great information, all in a few short weeks time.

    Thank you all!

    Bob
     
  15. Palos shooter

    Palos shooter Active Member

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    You can call Starline Brass in MO.They sell direct and ship right to your door..They are very reasonable..They make different calibers on different weeks..They will give you a shipping date..I think the min order is 500..
    That way all of the brass is the same and it all takes Large pistol primers..
    To start with try 4.5 grains of Bulsye powder..And a 185 gr semi wad cutter bullet..It makes a nice practice load and works the slide of a 45 auto..
    Try and get the over all Length OAL at 1.260 for the best accuracy
    45s are one of the easiest shells to reload.. When you first start make sure that the powder drops in every casing as it is easy to miss the powder drop..I know this from experience.I have a light and can see the powder before I seat the bullet
     
  16. Barrelbulge(Fl)

    Barrelbulge(Fl) TS Supporters TS Supporters

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    Primed, how much .45 brass do you need? Bulge.
     
  17. JerryP

    JerryP Active Member

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    I have never heard of a small primer in a 45acp case. When did this start? I have never paid less for small primers so what would be the point?



    BDodd, Only the 1050 has a station that swages and resizes the primer pocket.It is considered a commercial loader and does not have the lifetime quarantee.
     
  18. primed

    primed Well-Known Member

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    Bulge

    I'd like to start with about 2000. Let me know if you have some for sale.

    Bob
     
  19. Shooting Coach

    Shooting Coach Well-Known Member

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    According to folks who test ammo for a living, and know far more than I, the main advantages of the small primer are; stronger case head, and more consistent velocity, with better accuracy potential.

    Non-toxic primers use a really HOT priming compound. Small primers are used to reduce battering on the breech face. Even with the small primers, they are crimped to again, reduce battering of the breech face.

    When non-toxic large primers were introduced, the flash holes were enlarged to, guess what, reduce battering of the breech face.

    My last batch of Blazer brass cased 45 Auto had small primers, and were not marked non-toxic.

    When I get a large enough batch of such brass, I load it up. No issues. When loading price point Hardball, I use 4.9 gr Titegroup with a Precision Delta 230 gr bullet, either case style.

    I can see in the near future, most metallic Pistol ammo with crimped primer pockets. I hope I am wrong, but I do use the Dillon 1050, which has always been set up to decrimp primer pockets.

    For folks who do not load commercial quantities on commercial machines, good decrimpers are available. I prefer the Wilson reamer. It can be chucked in a drill. I use the Wilson for military rifle brass. All my crimped pistol brass goes through the 1050. YMMV
     
  20. Leo

    Leo Well-Known Member

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    When people shot real bullseye matches, (held the pistol in one hand and aimed the sights) There was some high dollar match ammo made with small primer pockets. Since bullseye loads are low velocity, the small primer version was supposed to give better shot to shot consistancy. Even then, I just tossrd any I found in the scrap brass bucket. All I ever reloaded was the regular large primer style. Since ammo got so expensive, I have started reloading again. Good Luck
     
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