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20/20 on kids and guns

Discussion in 'Off Topic Threads' started by himark, Feb 4, 2014.

  1. himark

    himark Active Member

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    Whom ever seen the 20/20 on kids and guns show hopefully will have a different outlook on YOUNG kids (ages 3-8 yrs old)around hand guns.

    I am obviously a gun supporter and have plenty in the home. While I do not agree with there lefty attitude they made one point that was very valid. Kids at the young age 5 or 6 not matter how much preaching and educating they have a uncontrolable curiousity and pick these guns up. Worst part is they look right down the barrel and aim it at there friends. They are just to young to know the difference and we can not expect a 5 year old to be told not to do something and they wont do it. They also had other kids 10 and up and after 8 to 9 the fatherly lessons have taken hold. Those kids KNEW how to handle the gun since educated and followed the family rules and gun safety. The young kids JUST do not get it.

    I would never want to see a kid killed like this (or anybody) and if you have a handgun AND a super young kid please be responsible and lock the gun or trigger lock it. Terrible way to learn your kid did not listen. FLAME away.
  2. Catpower

    Catpower Well-Known Member

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    Flame away at what? Anyone with half a working brain cell knows to not have guns accessible to kids
  3. MDJ67

    MDJ67 Member

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    I also watched the program. I feel not enough discipline in kids nowadays . When I was a kid no meant no! Having said that the familys without guns ,how do they educate them ? I was brought up with firearms makes a BIG differance. I agree they must be locked up because you do not get a second chance. I felt the show was a little one sided. Hard to believe. lol
  4. Donm

    Donm Member

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    And yet there are states that say it is ok for kids at the age of 6 to hunt. I really feel that unless a child is old enough and physically capable to handle a gun safely they should not be allowed to do so. Don't get me wrong I am all for kids hunting but unless they can control the gun they should not be allowed to shot it.
  5. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    "The young kids JUST do not get it."

    So true! But remember, there are a lot of parents who aren't all "there" too that "do not get it".

    If you have a firearm in you home, YOU had better take charge and TEACH safety and OBEY ME, I am your parent not your friend!!

    Too many parents have been "brainwashed" by education and government that discipline doesn't work!! There is a reason why your BUTT is so tender!!!

    I cured my kids curiosity simply by telling them, if you want to see them and handle them just ask me and I will let you. After about the second time, their "curiosity" was a thing of the past when it came to all the firearms in the house.

    The only reason some of my guns are locked up(in a safe)is to keep the "criminals" hands off them.

    Oh ya, if you parents, and you KNOW who your are, would take control and remove the xbox'es and play stations and limit TV/computer watching, you'd have better success and "teaching" your kids. BUT I understand there are 40 year old "kids" still playing them and can't get enough murder and mayhem into their little pea brains.

    And no I didn't watch 20/20, I have better things to do with my time!
  6. huntinjoe

    huntinjoe Member

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    +++ for timberfaller, I agree 100%..............Joe
  7. Chango2

    Chango2 Active Member

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    Simple: Children should not be around guns in an unsupervised situation. I was, and most of my friends were, but not all children are responsible nor have the cognition to understand that guns really can easily kill or be loaded by mistake. "We" had at least average intelligence, and, no, we were not scared into complying nor punished via physical means. Just had enough common sense by about age 8. Simply buy a safe and or, if that is unaffordable, gunlocks and always keep ammo separate from guns. Keep the "housegun", e.g. a loaded handgun, in one of those quick access vaults if you feel a need.

    It only takes one exception, i.e., an irresponsible child (or adult) to cause a tragedy. Same thing with dangerous chemicals and vehicles. The tragedy that is the exception is too high a price to pay.
  8. timberfaller

    timberfaller Well-Known Member

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    Now if we could just take care of the "texting", "drunk", "pot head" drivers off the road.........

    Don't forget about the "5 gallon" pails laying around. If we could just get a handle on all these "tragedy's" we are plagued with.
  9. timb99

    timb99 Well-Known Member

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    It was horsecrap journalism.

    Watch this well done reply.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSk1UkqBx58&feature=youtu.be
  10. pyrdek

    pyrdek Active Member

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    Back around 1972 or so I was a Field Sports Director for a Boy Scout Camp one camping season. This was in northwestern PA not very far from the Ohio border and directly on the shores of Lake Erie. As the FSD I also ran the rifle range where ALL scouts attending the Summer Camp got a few rounds of .22 to shoot at a target 50 feet away. Prior to doing this however they received a lesson on safe gun handling. All firing, other than those trying to qualify for the Shooting Merit badge, was done from the prone position on mats. There was a ribbon tied across the firing line about 18 inches above the ground. No muzzle was allowed above the ribbon and it always had to be pointed down range.

    The scouts were only given the ammo once they were in position at one of the six firing points on the line. The scouts were told that if there was any violation, even with an unloaded rifle, like muzzle above the ribbon unless the rifle was being in place from the storage shed, any muzzle pointed at any thing other than a safe direction (not toward the road, the camp buildings or grounds) any person or any other safety violation, they would be immediately banned from the range for the remainder of their camp week. If they felt my decision to ban them was incorrect or unjust, they could bring their Scoutmaster to meet with me. In the entire camp season, maybe 1,000 campers overall, I only banned two and both said that they knew, after I pointed out to them,where they made their mistake and they accepted the banning for the remainder of the week without question.

    These were any and all Scouts that came to the camp and that included Cubs and Weblos (transition from Cub to Boy Scout). With the Cubs and Weblos, their Scoutmaster or assistant had to be present. The Boy Scouts did not have to have a Master present but the SM could be present if they wished to attend.

    There was one incident which provided a good teaching moment. One scout, after the "Commence Fire" command was given, had an shot hit the ground maybe 10 or 15 feet forward of the firing line. I immediately called a Cease Fire, Clear and Ground. (I asked the scout what happened. his front elbow slipped off he mat and the gun fired. I asked him in very quiet voice if I could use this as a example. He seemed to think that I was going to scold hom. Nope. All I said was this is an example of why we have these safety rules. I pointed out to all of them that he kept the gun pointed downrange in a safe direction, only had his finger on the trigger when he was pointed at the target and the range was live. Because he did all the right things, there was no injury to anyone or property damaged. I then gave him a replacement round and the range was made live again.

    What this whole summer camp showed was that children are capable of being exposed to firearms, under proper supervision, and learning both safety and responsibility while using firearms. If they are not handling firearms safely, it is the parent or guardian who has failed the youth.
  11. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    What rational adult, unlike the brain dead ones on 20/20, put guns into the backpacks and lunches of children?

    And lumping 18 to 20 year old victims of gang and drug violence into firearms injuries involving children?

    Good grief. This program was a politically driven hack job.

    Do a google search for: 20/20 children guns rebuttal.

    A lot of good counterpoints will be found.
  12. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Donm, quote: <i>"And yet there are states that say it is ok for kids at the age of 6 to hunt. I really feel that unless a child is old enough and physically capable to handle a gun safely they should not be allowed to do so. Don't get me wrong I am all for kids hunting but unless they can control the gun they should not be allowed to shot it."</i>

    Children under 18 in Oregon must possess a hunters safety card in order to hunt on public lands or private lands their parent (or legal guardian) does not own. As for minimum age, the course description notes this:

    <i>"There is no minimum age to attend a course, but children under age 11 often have a difficult time with the material. Younger students may also lack the upper body strength necessary to handle a firearm safely and control the muzzle when performing loading and unloading drills."</i>

    There are kids under 11 who have successfully passed the class. They are the exceptions. And I think that ability, not age, should be the lower limit. This is a good way of going about it.

    I took hunters safety back in the early 1970s. When my kids took it, I audited the course with my son, and took the course with my daughter as a prerequisite to becoming an instructor. I wound up contracting near fatal pneumonia and then later job conflicts prevented me from carrying that out. But I was glad to take the course because a lot of things have changed in the last 40+ years. In addition, you'll find that many states require a hunters safety card from your home state before you can hunt there, regardless of age. Most of the adults in the class were taking it for that exact reason.
  13. himark

    himark Active Member

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    Brian,

    How many 5 year olds passed the test?

    Back on topic I said 5 and 6 year old kids! I agree we can educate and fulfill our responsibilities as adults when kids are older than this. BUT, I have to agree these LITTLE kids 4-6 years old have to high of curiousity and all I am saying is I would not want to find out my friends kid was killed because dad kept a loaded .40 on the night stand.
  14. trim tab

    trim tab Active Member

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  15. CharlieAMA

    CharlieAMA Well-Known Member

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    20/20 was patronizing those kids for their own anti-gun agenda, just like Hussein used that injured Army Ranger during his State of the Regime diatribe. What does Diane Sawyer know about guns, except that her hair dryer is shaped similar to one.
  16. 22hornet

    22hornet Active Member

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    I spent a lot of time at my Grandparents home when I was a kid. There were always lots of kids my age around; siblings, cousins and friends. Their home was in a rural hollow with the closest neighbor about a mile away. I'm not kidding when I say there was a gun in every corner. Pap even kept a loaded .38 revolver under his pillow. We all knew it was there, and we also knew to never touch it.

    It all comes down to discipline. We knew we would be punished for disobeying our elders. Kids don't respect adults anymore. Most modern adults won't punish their children. They would rather be friends to their kids instead of doing the hard thing by being responsible adults.
  17. Brian in Oregon

    Brian in Oregon Well-Known Member

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    himark, you lost me. I don't know at this point what you are going on about, because initially I thought we were on the same page that the lower limit should be by ability, as you state that over and over. So you want gov.org to set a legal minimum age, is that it?
  18. Traders

    Traders Member

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    If the lower limit for using a gun were to be "ability", I think you would find that there are many 5 year olds and perhaps younger that could pass the standard safety test required by various State agencies for issuing hunting licenses. Problem is, that same 5 year old is still a kid with all that means. If you leave the minimum age up to the parents to determine maturity, my guess is that a lot of really young, immature kids are going to be using guns. I really would not want to be in a corn field hunting pheasants knowing that there was a 5 year old with a loaded gun somewhere around.

    Minimum ages need to be set for gun use for the same reason we set them for driving, piloting, drinking, voting, smoking, marriage, etc. It is understood that by making a minimum age for qualification, it is inevitable that some individuals who might be perfect physically and maturity qualified will not be allowed to license. Nothing is free.

    I don't know about "himark", but yes I do want State government to set the legal minimum age for hunting.
  19. trapshootin hippie

    trapshootin hippie Well-Known Member

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    Traders, so you want a MAXIMUM age also? Same difference.

    GneJ
  20. Shooting Sailor

    Shooting Sailor Member

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    My kids grew up with lots of guns and shooting, going to the range, wearing their own ear muffs, and getting little bits of gun safety dribbled at them from the time they were able to listen. My son fired a handgun the first time at about 2 1/2 years of age. He held it in two hands, I lightly supported his hands, and he fired two single action shots from my J frame .22. My daughter did the same thing at about 3 1/2.

    There was never any curiousity about my firearms, or unauthorised usage, because they were allowed to handle them under supervision whenever they wanted. My son, at least, knew where the keys to the safe were from a pretty young age, and I imagine my daughter did as well. As they grew older, and were given their own firearms, they still only used them under my supervision. My son bought his first rifle, a .243, at age 12, and his first shotgun, an 870, at 14. He asked that they be locked in my safe, unless we were going to the range, or hunting. My daughter is content to keep shooting my firearms, using my ammunition. She's not stupid!

    The theory that a child is "too young" to be able to keep something straight in their mind is, I believe, a fallacy. Something that has been a fact since they were able to think and comprehend on their own, taught calmly and repeatedly , will remain in their minds forever. A hot stove burning them, or a nasty dog that bites if you get too close, are teachable things, just like firearms safety.

    All that being said, there is also no need to leave loaded firearms lying about within the reach or sight of a child. Your own kids, like mine, can be trusted, but can their friends, without the same level of training? You can't lump all kids in one category -safe or unsafe- based on chronological age. I'm sure we all can think of at least one adult person who we don't really feel handles their firearms safely at all times. This is a subject we could go round and round on, but we should all agree to err on the side of caution.