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11-87 failure to lock back bolt and feed new shell

Discussion in 'Uncategorized Threads' started by hmb, Jun 15, 2008.

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  1. hmb

    hmb Well-Known Member

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    You have to do some trouble shooting to find out the problem. Is it the ammo or the gun? That's the first question. Weak loads can cause the problem. If that's not the problem check the gun. Will the bolt lock back manually? Do you have a spare trigger group? You can swap trigger groups and see if that corrects the problem. Report the results so we can figure out what the problem is. HMB
     
  2. Shooting Jack

    Shooting Jack Active Member

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    Jerry, some of the Remington experts will probably answer up pretty soon but more info if needed. When you fire with only one shell in the gun, does it fully eject the spent hull? Jackie B.
     
  3. blizzard

    blizzard Active Member

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    Mine would do the same thing with slugs when it was new, so it's probably not your ammo. Dave in NY fixed mine. If my memory serves me, he shortened a long, thin piece that lays on the inside of the receiver. I forget what that part is called, but I have had NO problems since.



    Dave is on here quite a bit. He's a very nice gentleman, and I'm sure that he would give you some advice, if you can get his attention.
     
  4. k3uro

    k3uro Member

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    Hey,

    If the bolt stays back when it is cocked manualy, and you have ruled out your shells, I suspect it is your trigger group.

    Look at the Carrier Latch, 97010C, item 24 on the parts list. If you have dry fired the gun, with the trigger out, the shoulder on this part wears and will cause the basic symtom you described. You can manualy put it back with your finger while shooting and it may work for several shots.

    Take care,

    Jim
     
  5. GunDr

    GunDr Well-Known Member

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    "Almost" every time the bolt will not stay back will be a broken carrier latch(most often) or bent carrier.

    By looking at the trigger assy(out of the gun) the latch must engage with the raised tab of the carrier. But if one of the pivoting legs of the latch is broken, it's not strong enough to hold the carrier, which in turn holds the bolt open.

    Doug Braker
     
  6. Easystreet

    Easystreet Well-Known Member

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    Jerry,

    The first thing I would do is give the gun a good, thorough cleaning. This means removing the trigger assembly, the bolt assembly, and also the recoil spring in the stock.

    Also remove the magazine spring and clean the inside of the magazine tube and the spring thoroughly. In short, clean ALL the parts thoroughly in solvent such as kerosene or mineral spirits. Then, lightly lubricate them with Breakfree CLP or similar product and reassemble the gun. My guess is that will solve the problem.
     
  7. pyrdek

    pyrdek Well-Known Member

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    Three other things I would suggest that you take a look at in addition to what is quoted above:

    The O-ring that seals the front end of the gas ports. A broken ring could let excessive gas blow by weakening the impulse to the metal rings that drive the action bars.

    Check the metal gas rings, Cracks or chipped? Gaps in he rings NOT lined up or are they? If they are lined up together, gas could sneak by. They should be 180 dg. away from each other.

    The action bars themselves. Two things to look for. One is a cracked bar on one side. That could contribute to a push on one side but not as much on the other giving a slight binding effect. The other thing, if it fails to feed a shell from the magazine could be the slight angle on the action bar that drives the shell release is worn. If you can manually twist the action sleeve slightly and cause a failure to feed then twist it the other way (so as to raise the angled part) and the shell releases, that could be part of your problem.

    At one time or another I have had all of these problems come up in my 1100 or 11-87. If the shell release is worn but everything else is okay, you might be able to have a weld shop put a spot of weld on the bar and finish it off to keep the angle but raise the height a few hundredths. I did that once too and it held for maybe 10,000 rounds or so.
     
  8. Mr Newbius©

    Mr Newbius© TS Member

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    Just what in the world would cleaning the magazine spring and the magazine tube have to do with the problem. My guess is that has nothing to do at all with anything in regards to the problem.
     
  9. Easystreet

    Easystreet Well-Known Member

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    The OP said his gun was having problems feeding a shell from the magazine. This MIGHT be due to a dirty or gummed up magazine tube or magazine spring since that IS where the next shell comes from.

    Also, on the 1187 and 1100, the shell coming out of the magazine trips the carrier release to raise the next shell into position to be chambered by the bolt. A dirty magazine or magazine spring can cause the shell coming out of the tube to have insufficient energy to trip the release.

    Any other questions?

    Easystreet
     
  10. pyrdek

    pyrdek Well-Known Member

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    Just thought of another possibility. Is the magazine tube showing any scoring or gouging or excessively bright spots or any bends, warps or dents/bulges? If the action ring is binding a bit because of one of these things, it might not have all the power needed to completely open the bolt and work the action.
     
  11. maclellan1911

    maclellan1911 TS Member

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    Im with easystreet. I am no gun smith but do look at many shooters guns. I hear just cleaned it all the time. Tear that thing down, clean both action spring tube and magazine tube like its a gun barrel. My Dad taught me this. When you gun starts giving you trouble take it home disassemble and clean complete. When you think it is clean clean it again. No how many times I said "Dad its clean" Then he would proceed to show me how clean it was not!!! Also week springs both action and mag can cause a host of issues.
     
  12. pyrdek

    pyrdek Well-Known Member

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    Hey SShotshell,

    What was the cause of your 11-87 failure? Inquiring minds want to know.
     
  13. hoofty43

    hoofty43 TS Member

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    I had the same problem from time to time with my 1187 it was my reloads. Factory loads worked great. The gunsmith told me the flange of the shotshell was oversize,even though I resized my shells. He was right and also stated the inside diameter was smaller on the 1187 than my 1100. Now I only load my GM shells no more than 5 times. Also had a small piece of plastic from a shotshell in the inner workings at one time. That drove me nuts till I striped the trigger assy and inner workings and cleaned everything. I had some problems with 3 inch shells in my 1187. Never did figure that problem out. So at times the geese kept flying.
     
  14. Neil Winston

    Neil Winston Well-Known Member

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    Light loads may do this. Ported barrels often do. You can't solve either of these with common-sense tests, since you'd think 3-dram AA's would pin this problem down by providing proper functioning but often they won't, though another brand might.

    What shells are you using and is the barrel ported?

    Neil
     
  15. larryjk

    larryjk Member

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    I really hate to mention this but, the barrel on every 11-87 is "ported" by the factory, 2 3/4" barrels having twice as many ports as a 3" barrel. The pressure at these factory installed ports (about half way down the barrel) should have done their job long before the wads pass any other ports nearer the muzzle! One other thing to check is to use a drill bit to clean the ports that cause the gun to function.
     
  16. Old Cowboy

    Old Cowboy Active Member

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    Maybe the gas cylinder collar (that round tin thing that slides over the end of the magazine tube just before you slide on the forearm) has become spread out too much, alowing the gas spring (that circular flat spring that snaps on outside the gas cylinder to control the amount of gas venting out the two relief ports) to open too far. screwing the fore-end cap on too tight can slowly spread the gas cylinder collar out---------causing the action to "short stroke".

    John C. Saubak
     
  17. Easystreet

    Easystreet Well-Known Member

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    Larryjk wrote: "The pressure at these factory installed ports (about half way down the barrel) should have done their job long before the wads pass any other ports nearer the muzzle!"

    Not necessarily true. Ports near the muzzle can affect the functioning of the gun. Just because the shot charge and wad have passed the gas cylinder ports, that doesn't necessarily mean that the gas cylinder has received all the gas it needs to operate properly.

    That shot charge is moving about 1100 to 1200 fps when it passes the gas ports and there needs to be sufficient pressure DURATION for the gun to function properly. Ports near the end of the barrel will reduce the duration of the pressure at certain levels and may adversely affect the operation of the gun.
     
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my 11-87 scoring shells as it feeds with some feed problems