My routine was to always reload and close my gun as quickly as possible. This of course without causing any distraction to my squadmates. Typically I would close my gun immediatly after the person following me fired theirs. This allowed me to stay focused on all targets thrown and be in a ready position when my turn came around again. But again, I see nothing has changed here. It has always been the case where those who register tens of thousands of targets each year will often (not always) be the ones who close up right away. Where the weekend recreation or league shooter will not. cls

If your timing is right, only the nasty souls will complain. If you're going to do it, I suggest closing the gun immediately after the person two posts before you fires his gun. Then keep the gun down (not shouldered) and STILL.

-Gary

Redcobra - You obviously do not shoot registered ATA targets at the clubs you frequent.

ATA rules allow a closed gun when in the firing position, whether or not it is your turn. The firearm must be pointed down range.

A gun club must follow ATA rules if it is holding a registered shoot. If you were to interrupt my routine during a registered shoot, calling a 'cease fire', You would also be refunding all shooters their entry fees.

The ATA safety record of over 100 years of competition shooting without a fatality is still intact.

Doug Sims

I was shooting recently with someone on the squad I never shot with before. What he did put fear in my heart. When he was done on station 5 and I beleive he was the third shooter, he closed his action on a live shell.When the fifth shooter shot he walked behind everyone with a live round in the chamber. Everyone on the squad had a strange look on their faces but said nothing. When the round was over I went over to him and resolved that problem real quick. His excuse was that he was a newby. The next week I brought in a book on trapshooting etiquette and gave it to him. Mike.

Many top shooters I have talked with say that squad rhythm is over rated. Why, because they say it is not a team sport, but each person is competing as an individual.

There really is no safety issue with a shooter a post or two to the right of the person currently shooting having a closed, loaded gun as long as it is pointed down range. Accidental discharge would cause no more harm than if the next shooter were to wait until the shooter to his left shot, closed the loaded gun, and then accidentally fired.

I've watched shooting squads who shoot together all the time. The shooter two posts to the right closes the gun when the shot is fired, holds the gun down, and mounts when the shooter to his left fires. Good rhythm, no safety issues.

Skeet doesn't compare, because there is only one shooter on the station at any one time.

Consider 5-stands. All five stations have guns loaded with two shells after the command to load is given. No safety issues there either, as long as guns are pointed down range.

Danny

Most top dogs close before their turn. I close when the person before me closes.

Gun downrange, finger off the trigger.

Just because the "top dogs" as you put them do it does NOT make it right!

Yes, it's OK to close your gun before it's your turn to shoot. These guys who think it ain't must not shoot much ATA registered?

John C. Saubak

Bob, and just because you may not do it, does NOT make it WRONG either.

I don't mind if the person to my right closes his gun, but I do mind if he begins to raise the gun up to his shoulder BEFORE I shoot. It is particularly bothersome if we are shooting handicap and he is a yard in front of me.

Charlie

Charlie,

Me and a couple of others noticed this very thing happening a few weeks ago at a shoot...Guy on post 3 would close and mount on his turn, and dude on post 4 would follow suit BEFORE post 3 had shot.

I did not say it did.

You guys can do what you want. Your big boys.

Old Cowboy,

What the hell does shooting ATA or not have to do with this subject??? That is the dumbest statement I've ever heard.

It may be okay but why do it? Shooting trap is not a speed contest. It is common courtesy to respect other shooters time to shoot and not use their time to close your gun, move around or mount your gun.

Where's the safety issue? I shoot pistols shoulder to shoulder with other people all the time. Same with rifles. We aren't even talking about firing at the same time, but just merely have a round loaded. If the gun is pointed down range and your finger off the trigger like it should be, there's no safety issue. Period. If the gun is pointed at someone else, round or not, then you have a safety issue.

Now I'll admit this is a pet peeve of mine, but too often people make up firearm rules that they follow and somehow surmise that anyone not following those rules is being unsafe. While rules are great, safety comes down to using your brain first and foremost. I agree 100% you should be courteous and definitely don't close your gun (particularly the bolt on a SA) when someone else is shooting, but let's not suggest that it's somehow unsafe to do so.

I can't wait to see what switchblade wants us to settle next. I don't care if you load and close early, we do it all the time at 5 Stand, but you better pick up your hulls when you are done. Mark

Hell no! Bad manners. Just wait till the guys gun goes bang before you start doing anything with your gun. You're also doing it in a right handed man's view. Very distracting. Wont kill you wait an extra second. Whats the hurry?

I close my gun the instant the man to my left pulls the trigger..thats early enough for me

right charley closeing gun is ok but mounting gun when i'm shooting is not and i will let the guy know it too jim

switchblade, are you related to senior smoke?

Pertinent section from the ATA rulebook: (nothing says you can't do it)

10. All guns must have the action opened and contain no live or empty shells at any time, except while the shooter is on the firing line. A break open gun’s action may be closed when it is in a gun rack but it shall not contain a live or empty shell. Repeat offender(s) of these Official Rules will be given a 30 day suspension upon a second violation of these Rules; a third violation of these Rules will result in a 90 day suspension; and further violations will be reviewed by the Executive Committee for further disciplinary action.

11. As a safety precaution, test shots will not be permitted under any circumstance.

12. A contestant shall place a live shell in his/her gun only when on a post facing the traps. In Singles and Handicap shooting he/she may place only one (1) live shell in his/her gun at a time and must remove it or the empty shell(s) before moving from one post to another. In Doubles shooting he/she may place two (2) live shells in his/her gun at a time and must remove both live or empty shells before moving from one (1) post to another. In changing from one (1) post to another, the shooter shall not walk in front of the other competitors.

13. Snap caps or recoil reduction devices may be excluded from the above only if colored a safety orange as to permanently identify them as not being a live or empty shell.

14. A contestant may hold his/her gun in any position when it is his/her turn to shoot. The contestant must in no manner interfere with the preceding shooter by raising his/her gun to point or otherwise create an observable distraction.

15. All guns used by contestants must be equipped, fitted and utilized so as not to eject empty shells in a manner that substantially disturbs or interferes with other contestants.

16. All persons including competitors, referee/scorers, and trap personnel must wear appropriate eye and hearing protection while on the trap field. Failure to comply may result in disqualification.

17. No shooter shall be permitted to participate in any ATA event while seated in or otherwise using a golf cart on the firing line. Single passenger conveyances are the appropriate means for participating should one require assistance due to permanent or temporary disability.

18. While not prohibited, the practice of resting the muzzle of a shotgun on a shooter’s toe is ill-advised and is discouraged.

I set and close when the preceedign shooter's gun goes bang.

It depends on how the person goes about it. If they close their gun when someone elses goes bang, not a problem and you would never notice....but if they're closing it out of time, it can be a major distraction or even set off the trap. Shooting a closed gun can be advantagous if you feel you can read the trap.

Mind your own business and you might shoot better!

I close the action just before mounting the gun and calling for the bird

This question has been argued on this site many times in the past. I believe that closing your gun before it is your turn to shoot is clearly less safe than the alternative. I also no that many many of my fellow shooters do it. HOPEFULLY THIS WILL NEVER BE DISCUSSED IN A CIVIL COURT BECAUSE IF IT IS THE ATA WILL LOOSE AND THE SPORT WILL PAY DEARLY.

Good question Chuck. It makes no difference to me when other shooters close their guns. I do expect the shooter to my right will not move while I am in the act of shooting my target. I too often ask, Why are you in a big hurry to shoot. Tom

I shoot a 870, I drop my shell into the receiver when the person 2 shooters before me shoots, I close the gun as I mount it to my shoulder. After my 5th shot, I hold my gun up and prepare to walk to the next station completely unloaded. I never prepare to shoot until the person moving from #5 to #1 has gotten into position. When I move, my gun is always pointed straight upward and never at any concrete. Just me and the way I do it.

To those who say it's OK acccording to ATA rules (and it is) I have to assume that the participating clubs suspend their rules during ATA shoots. On a not so quick survey on the web of clubs around the country, in their statement of Club rules, I found that the great majority state "Shotgun action MUST BE OPEN at all times prior to your turn to shoot." (from the Detroit Gun Club website as an example). Several clubs have ATA shoots and this rule so I have written to them and asked what they do. So my question is,if an ATA shoot occurs at such a club, are club rules superseded by ATA practices?

Not sure what his game is as he was here before and knows damn well the answers he is going to get from this thread!? It is covered ad nauseam every year or two! You osha gurus will say no, some will even try to claim it is against the rules! Oh well, have fun blade! Tom Rhoads

Shoot, open it eject shell, reload, close and be ready when its my turn again ... There is nothing unsafe about it except in some peoples minds so they should shoot with other shooters of the same like ... Worry about you, let everyone else do the same ... If there was anything unsafe about it there would be a rule regarding it ... Some people like to fix a problem when there isn't even a problem ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

.

At our club, the five best shooters routinely shoot together.

As a group, they are as slow as molasses.

But they break all their targets, so who are we who miss a lot to ask them to hurry along ?

.

I think it is rude and unsafe. All the clubs I belong to, or have shot at have the same rule - gun stays open until it is your turn to shoot. We have had a couple of members argue this but the rule stood firm.

It is unsafe just for the fact that more than one shooter has a loaded, locked weapon on the line at the same time. if something happens that prevents the shooting to continue (trap breaks down, misfire or jam at the previous station, etc.)do the shooters remember that there gun is hot while the problem gets resolved? It's just easier for the Range Safety Officer to know only one gun is hot at a time. ATA can do what they want...I just feel safer knowing you who is hot on line and who is not.

John

My range only allows you to close the action when it's your turn to shoot, and that's what I've always done. I've shot a few ATA shoots and never even payed attention to (nor cared) what others did as long as it was safe. You can break any one of the four safety rules without anybody getting hurt, break two and bad things happen. If the gun is loaded and pointed down range with your finger off the trigger and there's nothing unsafe to shoot at down range, I couldn't care less what you do with your gun. I only ask that the shooter to my right AND MY LEFT, please refrain from actions until my gun goes BANG.

Mike

Again, you guys who don't want to be on the line with others who have loaded, closed actions: Don't ever shoot 5-stand. Before the first shot on station change, there are five people with loaded, closed actions with two shells each in their guns. After each turn, there are four people in the cages with two shells each load, with actions closed.

Does anyone know if the 5-stand safety record is worse than the trap safety record? (This is a legitimate question, I don't know the answer.)

By the way, our club rules are this: "Shotguns are not to be loaded until the shooter is on a station and is PREPARING to shoot. For trap: only one shell may be loaded at a time; for trap doubles: no more than 2 shells may be loaded at a time; for skeet: no more than 2 shells may be loaded at a time except at station 8 high when only 1 shell may be loaded; and for clays: no more than 2 shells may be loaded at a time. All loading is done ONLY when on a station."

PREPARING to shoot. I believe that means all the actions taken after the last shot was taken by the shooter.

Danny

If it really bothers you nervous nillies, just shoot with the kids, their rules might be better suited to some....

I'm a new shooter with a semi-auto and here's what happened to me:

I was on station 5. I put a shell in my gun and closed the action when the shooter on station 3 fired. The shooter on station 4 misfired. I waited while he messed around with his gun. He asked if I could look at it. I did. Eventually forgot that my gun was loaded. Fortunately someone saw my action was closed and yelled at me (in a friendly way).

From now on, I don't load until it's my turn.

You forgot your gun was loaded?

CLS, You just a pot stirrer or what. You and I both shot enough all over the country to know this is just a dumb a$$ question. :)