Timing of the Grand AmericanMost Recent Posts First
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| Posted By | Posted Date/Time |
| Barry C. Roach | 31-Jul-10 - 02:49 PM ET |
| skeet_man | 31-Jul-10 - 02:50 PM ET |
| Big Heap | 31-Jul-10 - 02:55 PM ET |
| Hitapair | 31-Jul-10 - 02:58 PM ET |
| j2jake | 31-Jul-10 - 03:05 PM ET |
| ivanhoe | 31-Jul-10 - 03:08 PM ET |
| Barry C. Roach | 31-Jul-10 - 04:00 PM ET |
| Pat Ireland | 31-Jul-10 - 04:04 PM ET |
| ivanhoe | 31-Jul-10 - 04:25 PM ET |
| DanLee | 31-Jul-10 - 05:50 PM ET |
| BigM-Perazzi | 31-Jul-10 - 06:08 PM ET |
| j2jake | 31-Jul-10 - 06:11 PM ET |
| gary0920 | 31-Jul-10 - 06:40 PM ET |
| Pull & Mark | 31-Jul-10 - 07:08 PM ET |
| glenn mcleod | 31-Jul-10 - 07:16 PM ET |
| 1oldtimer | 31-Jul-10 - 07:18 PM ET |
| Ahab | 31-Jul-10 - 08:06 PM ET |
| Pull & Mark | 31-Jul-10 - 10:41 PM ET |
| scdrch | 31-Jul-10 - 11:21 PM ET |
| skeet_man | 31-Jul-10 - 11:31 PM ET |
| smoking357 | 01-Aug-10 - 01:30 AM ET |
| Barry C. Roach | 01-Aug-10 - 01:56 AM ET |
| JLSO5 | 01-Aug-10 - 04:10 PM ET |
| smoking357 | 01-Aug-10 - 04:18 PM ET |
| WPT | 01-Aug-10 - 04:29 PM ET |
| smoking357 | 01-Aug-10 - 04:32 PM ET |
| skeet_man | 01-Aug-10 - 04:43 PM ET |
| noknock1 | 01-Aug-10 - 04:48 PM ET |
| WPT | 01-Aug-10 - 05:00 PM ET |
| smoking357 | 01-Aug-10 - 05:07 PM ET |
| dmarbell | 01-Aug-10 - 08:20 PM ET |
| FlaLagarto | 02-Aug-10 - 12:07 PM ET |
| gdbabin | 02-Aug-10 - 12:21 PM ET |
| FlaLagarto | 02-Aug-10 - 12:28 PM ET |
| 1oldtimer | 02-Aug-10 - 02:29 PM ET |
| dverna | 02-Aug-10 - 03:08 PM ET |
| JLSO5 | 02-Aug-10 - 05:24 PM ET |
In between wheat and corn/soybean harvests.
October would be problematic, as a lot of vendors, and some shooters, would have to choose b/w the Grand in Sparta, or World Skeet and/or World Sporting in San Antonio, which are back to back in early october...
The hunting season? Many of these folks only shoot trap for a pastime waiting for the fowl to fly.
In Oct kids would be in school and not available to work at the Grand is what I was told as to historically why it was held in the summer rather than the fall.
Reguardless of where it is held I think the date needs to be relooked. Move it to cooler times. Yes there are issues with any move but come on guys, think outside the box for a change. JMO, Jake
The Grand is like World Championship of Trap. The target year ends roughly two weeks later.
Why would anyone shoot the Championships in the beginning of the shooting year?
BTW Jake if it is moved to a cooler month you will be notified what events you will be working because the kids will be in school. Is that the kind of "outside the box" you were looking for.
Bob Lawless
Every way you look at it there is a something wrong with later dates. Too late and no kids to work and fewer able to get out of school to shoot.
I like to shoot when it is hot.
Pat Ireland
It certainly won't help promote a reason to shoot among the SCTP and AIM participants will it????
Bob Lawless
It's all location. Move the Grand to northern WI, MN, or the UP, and the temperatures in August will be delightful.
Dan
August in Hawaii....
Bill, I like your out look, just what I was suggesting.
Pat Ireland, I too like the hot weather, my business depends on it. I work in the out doors in NE Fl and am better conditioned to handle "Hot" better than most. However there are many who may attend in cooler times than not. Its all good and I will attend regardless of time or location because it is the Grand. Jake, Bob Lawless, I am a volunteer and should assistants be requested I will. You?
Jake - now that's a great idea and thinking outside the box. Everyone who shoots at the Grand volunteers 1 hour of scoring. Now that would be giving back to the sport.
I brought this same thing up last year. Both Skeet and Sporting Clays hold there World or Grands as it were in Oct. at the end of there Shooting Season. Its nicer to shoot and the kids have there Biggest shoot in the summer to allow parents to focus on the kid during his/her time. It makes perfect sense to me, even if you hold all three back to back in the same place to make it easier for the vendors. Or give the vendors a week or two to make it up to Sparta after. What's the problem. The NSSA AND NSCA figure clay target shooting season should end with winter approaching, as shooters are starting to gear up for shooting at some migrating birds at that time before they hang them up during winter months. The ATA can extend their end season to Oct. same as the other two no problem. The nicer weather may bring in more shooters, I know it would make it more enjoyable for not only shooting but to visit all the vendors as well. But it won't happen will it. My 2 cents. Break-em all. Jeff
If you held it in June the shooters in the northern states would be lucky if they had 500 targets shot. Snow doesn't leave until middle of April. Hotter the better. Glenn
Lets face it, The average temp in Sparta is too hot for outdoor activities in August. With all the unemployment,adult help should be no problem. Might be more dependable. I have shot Sparta every year and must spend a lot of time in my auto with AC on. Target year dates can be easily changed. Skeet & Sporting Clay vendors don't usually set up at Trapshoots. Why not experiment? Why are so many not willing to change? What do we have to loose? What if it brought in more shooters! CED
I have an idea for all you whiners and wannabe changers.
Why not have everyone shoot at their home club when ever the weather is nice ... using 2 hole targets, and mail your scores in.
The EC won't have to run up traveling expenses ... and the winner gets last years shotgun from the President!
Like the 12-15 thousand dollars for a new shotgun every year for the president could totally pay for some nice property with a building that the ATA could own!!! Meetings could be set at 1-3 of the 5 largest shoots every year so the members do not have to flip the bill for meetings as well. In other words follow the NSSA AND NSCA. Owning something would be GRAND at the GRAND would it not. Interest rates and propertys are at a all time low, and NOW would be a good time to start looking into it would it not. Anyone who wants to do good things for the ATA should not have to be BRIBED with a shotgun to do the job, he/she should WANT TO DO IT and already have a favorite shotgun. I may only be in the ATA for 5 years but I'm not blind. There I said it. My 2 cents. I do like Frank and have known him for about 4 years. He can run a buiness and make money at it. Lets see what he can do!!! Break-em all. Jeff
Being a youth shooting coach, it definitely would be tougher to have the AIM and SCTP as well as the ATA youth shooters at a shoot this large after school has started and here in MO many of us have our teams shooting FFA and 4h shoots on the weekends so that doesn't fit into the equation either.
Trying to attract young people to the sport is hard enough without changing the dates to make it even more inaccessible. If you want to make the sport grow we need the involvement of the youth and at the same time we can pick up some of their parents also.
For this reason leave it alone.
JMHO, Dean
As far as the vendors, what about Kolar, Krieghoff, Perazzi, Blaser, Beretta, Browning, Winchester, Remington, Federal, ect? They all attend the major skeet/sporting/trap shoots, and I doubt each company has more than one "team" that attends these shoots to display, sell, and repair... A few smaller vendors overlap, but almost all of the largest ones certainly do.
Just knock off all the whining and excuse-making, and move the shoot to late September or early October.
1 Oldtimer, The Grand is the culmination of the year's shooting. It is placed where it is because all of the state shoots are finished, then the zone shoots and finally the Grand. It's all part of a scheduled scheme of shoots leading up to crowning the champions of the sport. It's not just another shoot. It's for all the marbles.
I'd like to see it the first week of September but that excludes the kids and we can't do that, unless we give the kids their own Grand, but that doesn't seem fair. It may become necessary though.
Frankly, I don't give a rat's patooty how the Sporties and the skeeters do it. We're the original clay target sport with the greatest and oldest traditions.
Best regards, Barry
The NSSA world shoot use to be in San Antonio or Savannah in July every year. And that ended the skeet year for most people. It took a smart man to figure out that if you moved it to Oct. it extended the skeet shooting year 3 months. Perfect weather and more targets shot during the calender year. The same arguments came up kids in school, hunting season, ect., ect. The sporting people did the same thing and attendance has increased every year since.
Looks like the Skeeters got this figured out. Good for them.
November sounds a little better than October.
Well Pat Ireland likes shooting when its hot, that should be a good enough reason to leave it alone and make everyone else suffer ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
I'm not sure what Pat's age is, WPT, but Florida is full of older people who physically need heat that is unbearable to most others. Perhaps the age distribution explains why some shooters don't object to the brutal heat.
Skeet & Sporting Clays both have their own "Junior" event which is equivalent to the world championships (its the Junior World for skeet (which happens to be this wknd), dunno what the sporting clays version is called).
If a reason is because of needing 'kids' to work the shoot, then move it to the second week of June and start the new target year after that. Northern shooters will still have the same amount of snow free months to register targets.
smokin357,
That must be why I prefer it not be as hot, being much younger and better looking than Pat Ireland and Zardozforty I like balmy breezes and the temp around 75/80 with little or no humidity ... Much like Winter in Arizona ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
How many trap fields are at that skeet facility in St. Anthony?
The Skeeters might be on to something. South Texas around Thanksgiving is a good idea. SA is centrally located for both coasts and a nice vacation destination when the weather is right.
I'm with Pat too. I met Pat at the NC Dogwood Shoot, held in April. He complained about the cool weather, so we tried to get him some help to keep warm.
Note: Pat is the old guy on the right.
Danny
I'll jump in here .. I'm with Pat and Jake.. give me the heat !!
I'll take 90 over 70 any day.. .
Jerry B.
Hot is better... given my druthers, I'd rather sweat than shake anyday!
Guy B.
OOPS.. forgot Zardo.. wouldn't want to do that.. and Guy .. welcome to a great bunch.. I think we have enough for our own squad now.. .
Barry--Most changes are made for the betterment of the majority. Status quo has always deterred progress! Traditions aren't always right. CED
1oldtimer,
Change is a scary thing. Most people/organizations resist it.
It takes great leadership, guts, brains, and determination to manage change and stay the course, or make corrections, when things do not go as planned.
Look at Sparta. Now that was heck of a change and it demonstrated the lack of leadership we had at the time. We ended up with a great venue in the wrong place. The ATA knows this but can/will not admit it.
We cannot move the location but moving the time could help attendance. Not much registered going on in Ohio in the fall - maybe some of those "crybabies" would come. Those of us who cannot take the heat will come and/or shoot more events. I don't buy the AIM/SCTP excuse. High school kids take off during the year for other activities - why is shooting any different?
But it will never happen. The EC has bigger issues to deal with right now. The Glatz Report is taking center stage.
Don Verna
When does the trap shooting year end? To the guy who prefers 90's to 70's I just can't even address that.
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Subject:
Timing of the Grand American
From: Barry C. Roach
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